View Poll Results: Poll on where you stand on abortion in relation to women

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  • I favor forcing women to have children against her wishes.

    12 19.35%
  • I oppose forcing women to have children against her wishes.

    43 69.35%
  • IDK/Other

    7 11.29%
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Thread: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

  1. #81
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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    According to the poll over 71% of people think abortion is a right. So that settles it.

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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by ElijahGalt View Post
    And that's OK with you?
    Why would I object to the state investigating a possible case of child abuse?

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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Why would I object to the state investigating a possible case of child abuse?
    As much as abortion disgusts me, I don't see how the unborn is a child. Developing human? yes. Child? No.

  4. #84
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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Why would I object to the state investigating a possible case of child abuse?
    So every case of a mother who must choose an abortion to save her life will subsequently (and justly, in your opinion) be investigated for possible child murder?

    And a woman who has just experienced a traumatic miscarriage is also subject to an investigation for possible child murder? You're really willing to put these women through a hellish investigation/trial to determine or file possible murder charges?

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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by kenvin View Post
    According to the poll over 71% of people think abortion is a right. So that settles it.
    I voted again so as to lower the % to 70. If you would like I could lower it further.

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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?


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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    As much as abortion disgusts me, I don't see how the unborn is a child. Developing human? yes. Child? No.
    I understand. However, you're incorrect:

    "Child" 1 and "baby" 1 have pre-birth uses.
    A fetus is a "child" 2 and a "baby" 2 is a "child", thus we can call a fetus a "baby" 3.
    Legally a "child" 4 is one's natural offspring, which is what a pregnant woman carries.
    So, a pregnant woman carries her "child", her "unborn child", her "unborn baby".
    This makes her a "parent", specifically, a mother.



    "Organism" = "a living being".
    Human DNA = "human".
    "Organism" + Human DNA = "A Human Being".


    The unborn is a "child". Anyone who disagrees is simply wrong.

  8. #88
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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    No, joko, those are the consequences of the pure pro-life stance.

    The only things you need to believe in order to hold the pro-life stance:
    1. Unborn children are living human beings, and thus have the right to life.
    2. The right to life takes precedence over all other rights except another person's right to life.


    Both reasonable moral premises. Combine that with deontological ethics-- the idea that actions are right or wrong according to rules, regardless of consequences-- and you have a system in which no matter how much harm the unwanted pregnancy inflicts upon the victim, unless it is necessary to preserve her right to life, the termination of that unborn child is an unjustifiable wrongful act. And if you consider the unborn child to be morally relevant at all, one must simply accept that the harm done to it by abortion is greater than the harm done to the woman.

    Of course, I don't share those premises... which is why I am staunchly pro-choice.
    To claim that known consequences of an action are irrelevant to the value or ethics of the action is nonsensical.

    That is the problem with so many ideological declarations. I'm pretty much a down to earth person. A person can think any damn thing he or she wants to. I don't care. Why should I? I ONLY care about tangible realities and results.

    I understand the premise of "pro-life." You are right about that. I don't even have a problem if they believe that. What is so bothersome is that if you try to discuss any other actual effects or even if outlawing abortion would stop abortions, they refuse to discuss reality and instead tend to just start raging "abortion is murder!" Again, definitely not all pro-lifers do that.

    Ultimately, it is ALWAYS the actual consequences and not platitudes that judge an ideology. If a person believes abortion is murder that is what the person believes. If that is the beginning and ending of the topic, there really is little basis for discussion whatsoever. You are correct of their premises. But the consequences are not irrelevancies except in ideological wonderland.

    I don't believe terminating an early term pregnancy is wrong in any way - unless against the woman's wishes. HOWEVER, I don't think that is the singular issue on the topic. There are only 100 gray areas, social issues, psychological issues, spiritual if a person is interested in such topics, economic ones, practical ones such as what happens after an unwanted or known severely handicapped child is born, the age of the victim or unplanned pregnancy girl (now as young as age 8) etc.

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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I understand. However, you're incorrect:

    [FONT="]"Child" 1 and "baby" 1 have pre-birth uses.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]A fetus is a "child" 2 and a "baby" 2 is a "child", thus we can call a fetus a "baby" 3.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]Legally a "child" 4 is one's natural offspring, which is what a pregnant woman carries.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]So, a pregnant woman carries her "child", her "unborn child", her "unborn baby".
    This makes her a "parent", specifically, a “mother”.[/FONT]

    [FONT="] [/FONT]

    "Organism" = "a living being".
    Human DNA = "human".
    "Organism" + Human DNA = "A Human Being".


    The unborn is a "child". Anyone who disagrees is simply wrong.
    I guess that's one way of looking at it. The statement, "she is pregnant with child" also reinforces this..

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    Re: Where you stand on abortion in relation to women?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I understand. However, you're incorrect:

    [FONT="]"Child" 1 and "baby" 1 have pre-birth uses.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]A fetus is a "child" 2 and a "baby" 2 is a "child", thus we can call a fetus a "baby" 3.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]Legally a "child" 4 is one's natural offspring, which is what a pregnant woman carries.[/FONT]
    [FONT="]So, a pregnant woman carries her "child", her "unborn child", her "unborn baby".
    This makes her a "parent", specifically, a “mother”.[/FONT]

    [FONT="] [/FONT]

    "Organism" = "a living being".
    Human DNA = "human".
    "Organism" + Human DNA = "A Human Being".


    The unborn is a "child". Anyone who disagrees is simply wrong.
    You are absolutely wrong. A fertilized human embryro in a petri dish isn't a child. In fact, it is absurd to claim it is a child and for nearly all of those - 99+% - it will never be capable of becoming child no matter what is done.

    To claim that is "a child" is truly an absurdity. No different that to claim a condom kills half a child just like if a person cut a newborn baby in half is anything but absurd.

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