View Poll Results: If a person smears a Christian as a "homophobe," should that person returh fire?

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  • Yes. If they call you a homophobe you should be able to comment on their morals/etc.

    5 16.67%
  • No, they shouldn't return fire because they deserve it.

    1 3.33%
  • Simply ignore the smears and continue debating.

    3 10.00%
  • How about we show some respect and NOT smear eachother?

    16 53.33%
  • Don't know/Other

    5 16.67%
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Thread: Slander in Politics

  1. #201
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    Who said anything about evidence? I simply said an argument. Reasoning is often valid, as evidence. The problem is Andy, you, like so many, are mesmerised by statistics without realising you have to get your thought right first and use thought to make any sense of them.

    I did not say he has to provide statistics, just more than a bald assertion, so your complaint makes no sense.

    Can you please show me where I asked for evidence? For instance this post talks only of reason and arguments;



    Next time you try and swoop in to keep up the side, at least make sure you say something that makes sense Andy.
    Well, I noticed that you evaded the question of why you shouldn't answer questions on your own sex life. if you can't answer the question "because it's none of your business", why should you ask someone else to?
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  2. #202
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Well, I noticed that you evaded the question of why you shouldn't answer questions on your own sex life. if you can't answer the question "because it's none of your business", why should you ask someone else to?
    I answered about my sex life. I said I'm an unmarried traditional Christian.

    He should have to answer it because he made the assertion. Remember I didn't even bring up looking into people's sex lives as he is talking about; interviewing people or whatever. I haven't really been making any argument except pointing out question begging. My entire point to him and Teamosil is you cannot just say things like it is none of your business or Christians who believe homosexuality is a sin are bigots without some sort of argument. This should be obvious, there is no nuance in it, despite what Removable Mind says. When you make an assertion you must argue it, that is all I'm saying, this doesn't change just because you think the assertion is very trendy, left-liberal thinking. Such behaviour is the same sort of narrowed, unexamined ideological bigotry that 'homophobes' are often accused of.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 01-24-12 at 06:03 PM.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  3. #203
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    I answered about my sex life. I said I'm an unmarried traditional Christian.
    Yeah right. That's an answer.
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

  4. #204
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Yeah right. That's an answer.
    Right back at you, you ignored the substance of the issue. I did answer his question, who says I would have to give graphic details to answer it? But I don't need to answer it anyway, but you need to answer this, to properly be involved in the discussion;


    He should have to answer it because he made the assertion. Remember I didn't even bring up looking into people's sex lives as he is talking about; interviewing people or whatever. I haven't really been making any argument except pointing out question begging. My entire point to him and Teamosil is you cannot just say things like it is none of your business or Christians who believe homosexuality is a sin are bigots without some sort of argument. This should be obvious, there is no nuance in it, despite what Removable Mind says. When you make an assertion you must argue it, that is all I'm saying, this doesn't change just because you think the assertion is very trendy, left-liberal thinking. Such behaviour is the same sort of narrow, unexamined ideological bigotry that 'homophobes' are often accused of.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 01-24-12 at 06:12 PM.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  5. #205
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Gardener View Post
    I'm guessing "Wishful".
    Oh such wit you have, how could you ever of thought of such a biting comment. Alas, we cannot all be satisfied with the Israeli flag for a sexual partner.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  6. #206
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    The most enduring conflicts between citizens are caused by politicians and government officials... who say EVERYTHING, BUT TELL US NOTHING.

    Government lies. It lies profusely. It lies continually.

    Politicians lie. They lies even when lying isn't necessary. They lie from the moment they wake up till their sleeping moments at night. Then they dream about lying.

    People takes these lies at face value because they want to believe there is some inherent good in everybody, including politicians and government...despite the exponential forms of evidence produced by politicians and government and they accept them. We want to believe that our government is the best there is in the world. We want to believe in all of the fairy tales taught to us as kids, like George Washington cutting down the cherry tree...only to confess the truth. Thus we need to trust Government and it's officials. And the noble ride of Paul Revere. These stories, at best, are distortions of the truth...at worse, outright lies. It's called political propaganda and brainwashing.

    We are all taught by our corrupt systems of politics and government to search out for a lesser lie, more acceptable lie to embrace.

    That's my argument...what's yours?

  7. #207
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    My argument has only ever been that those who make assertions should support them with arguments; that the fact they are trendy, liberal opinions not iwthstanding.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 01-24-12 at 08:57 PM.
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  8. #208
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    My argument has only ever been that those who make assertions should support them with arguments; that the fact they are trendy, liberal opinions not iwthstanding.
    Ok, just ignoring for the minute that everybody has given you tons of arguments that you have been unable to come up with counter arguments to, what are your arguments? After all, you're the one trying to justify imposing your own personal morality on other people and forcing them to comply with your wishes with the force of the state. Seems like you're the one that needs to be making the case, no?

  9. #209
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Ok, just ignoring for the minute that everybody has given you tons of arguments that you have been unable to come up with counter arguments to, what are your arguments? After all, you're the one trying to justify imposing your own personal morality on other people and forcing them to comply with your wishes with the force of the state. Seems like you're the one that needs to be making the case, no?
    What arguments have been given? You gave no arguments, you simply made further assertions. To prove that Christians are bigots, or something similar, you simply asserted they had no right to have their opinions about gay marriage and similar enshrined in law. This is not an argument. You would be up in arms if I eventually tried to justify my assertion homosexuality was immoral with the further assertion it was unnatural.

    Removable Mind gave an argument and I praised him for it and liked his post. No one else gave arguments; just stating it is none of your business what people's private sex lives are is a further assertion and not an argument. You really have to understand the difference between just making brief, perfunctory and question begging assertions and actually making arguments if you wish to debate.

    I'm not really offering my own arguments, just critiquing others.
    Last edited by Wessexman; 01-24-12 at 09:12 PM.
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  10. #210
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    You are not giving an argument. You maintain it is never anyone's business, but you will not provide an argument. That is question begging, that is unexamined and narrow ideological bigotry as much as what the so called 'homophobes' are accused of.
    Exactly.

    I'm giving you a taste of your own medicine. I'm using your own logic against you.

    I'm a traditional Christian who is unmarried. But this doesn't change your question begging approach. You cannot simply state it is never anyone else's business, you must argue it.
    No I don't. I'm not arguing anything - I'm accepting your assumption that the sex lives of strangers IS my business. So let's get on with it - so you're an unmarried traditional Christian, which means you're a virgin? Do you masturbate? What do you think about when you masturbate? Would you want to have anal or oral when you get married?

    If you expect gays to submit to you butting into their private business, you shouldn't have a problem when it's done to you. So cough it up.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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