View Poll Results: If a person smears a Christian as a "homophobe," should that person returh fire?

Voters
30. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes. If they call you a homophobe you should be able to comment on their morals/etc.

    5 16.67%
  • No, they shouldn't return fire because they deserve it.

    1 3.33%
  • Simply ignore the smears and continue debating.

    3 10.00%
  • How about we show some respect and NOT smear eachother?

    16 53.33%
  • Don't know/Other

    5 16.67%
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Thread: Slander in Politics

  1. #121
    Dorset Patriot
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by misterman View Post
    But you're trying to simplify that meaning yourself too.
    Not exactly.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  2. #122
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    Again, it has nothing to do with whether Christianity is "wrong" or whatever. The question is whether it is ok for one demographic group to attack another demographic group that did them no harm. It isn't. Period. If the first group is "right" that the second group is immoral or whatever that doesn't change anything.

    It wouldn't be ok for Democrats to go around systematically denying Republicans equal rights would it? Or for right handed people to persecute left handed people? Or vice versa? It doesn't matter who is "right", that just isn't an acceptable way to behave.
    This entirely depends on definitions of harm and the role of government and all that sort of thing. You even make the claim that it not okay or acceptable to force their morality on others, which is ironic since these terms like okay and acceptable must be moralistic. I'm not saying you are completely wrong, I'm must saying you have to argue your position and not assume it.
    "It is written in the eternal constitution that men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." - Edmund Burke

  3. #123
    Irremovable Intelligence
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    1st Amendment = right to free speech - not the right to be heard.

    Just like Justice Scalia said Friday about complaints about Corporations being granted the right to unlimited spending on political ads - "Don't like the ruling then turn the TV channel, go to another radio station, ignore the newspaper ads."

    In other words.......

    I offer the same advice to those who believe that their religious beliefs have been criticized because others disagree with the tenets that are frequently espoused by its members.

    We don't see each other's beliefs as personal tenets, but rather shortcomings. Therein lies our sin.

    Humanity hasn't evolved enough to adopt, "Live an let live as long as one's rights truly havent been infringed on by others.". People have a very strange sense of personal boundaries. Many believe what goes on in the privacy of their neighbors home, despite the evidence their rights have not been infringed on...attack their neighbors anyway.

    Witch hunts are alive and well in 2012.

  4. #124
    Professor

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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by lizzie View Post
    You can take my words at face value.

    edit to add: You seem to be saying that Christians who don't support gay marriage rights are merely bigots. Bigotry is holding to an opinion blindly. A person who believes that a gay lifestyle is wrong or immoral isn't being bigoted, but thinks this based on his/her religious beliefs. That isn't the same thing as bigotry.
    Simply, I don't think a religious belief is sufficient basis for bigoted behavior.

  5. #125
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by OhIsee.Then View Post
    Simply, I don't think a religious belief is sufficient basis for bigoted behavior.
    I don't believe it is bigoted, as there is a basis for their belief, whether rational or irrational as you may yourself believe it is. Their behavior isn't really behavior, but is expression of thought and opinion. Behavior would be something that is concrete and enforceable. Thoughts and opinions don't fit the definition of behaviors.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

  6. #126
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    This entirely depends on definitions of harm and the role of government and all that sort of thing. You even make the claim that it not okay or acceptable to force their morality on others, which is ironic since these terms like okay and acceptable must be moralistic. I'm not saying you are completely wrong, I'm must saying you have to argue your position and not assume it.
    The bottom line is somebody can't use their personal religious beliefs to excuse bigotry because what is going on in their heads isn't relevant, it's how they act that matters. So a rationalization based on their own internal beliefs doesn't buy them anything. I don't care if they're Christian, Muslim, atheist, whatever, the same standard applies to them.

  7. #127
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    Not exactly.
    Pretty much.

    You insist that only one definition of the word can apply.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  8. #128
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    1st Amendment = right to free speech - not the right to be heard.

    Just like Justice Scalia said Friday about complaints about Corporations being granted the right to unlimited spending on political ads - "Don't like the ruling then turn the TV channel, go to another radio station, ignore the newspaper ads."
    Just found that, thanks.

    His exact quote:

    “I don’t care who is doing the speech — the more the merrier… People are not stupid. If they don’t like it, they’ll shut it off.”

    Couldn't have said it better. This obsession with controlling speech to manipulate election results is founded on the belief that the voters are too stupid to think for themselves.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  9. #129
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    The bottom line is somebody can't use their personal religious beliefs to excuse bigotry because what is going on in their heads isn't relevant, it's how they act that matters. So a rationalization based on their own internal beliefs doesn't buy them anything. I don't care if they're Christian, Muslim, atheist, whatever, the same standard applies to them.
    So who decides what's bigoted? Have you issued a rule book for the rest of us to abide by?

  10. #130
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    Re: Slander in Politics

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    The bottom line is somebody can't use their personal religious beliefs to excuse bigotry because what is going on in their heads isn't relevant, it's how they act that matters. So a rationalization based on their own internal beliefs doesn't buy them anything. I don't care if they're Christian, Muslim, atheist, whatever, the same standard applies to them.
    To them, it's not bigotry. They aren't trying to get you to buy something. They are expressing their own thoughts, based on their belief system. If you don't agree, then that's no problem, but they are no more bigots for living according to their beliefs than you are.
    "God is the name by which I designate all things which cross my path violently and recklessly, all things which alter my plans and intentions, and change the course of my life, for better or for worse."
    -C G Jung

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