View Poll Results: Should “equal opportunity” = free (gov funded) college to those who can complete it?

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Thread: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

  1. #1
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    Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    Should everyone have access to all types of college education and degrees regardless of their financial status and should the only factor that should be considered when allowing access to college education and degrees be their ability to complete such academic curriculum?

    Or should only those who can afford a college education or those select few who receive scholarships be allowed access to college education and thus, one’s financial status should be considered in addition to one’s ability to complete academic curriculum?

    What option did you pick or which one best reflects your beliefs and why?

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    The government should pay for college when it is statistically likely to lead to a greater increase in tax revenues than the expense of the program. Since we can't judge that on a case-by-case basis, we need a rules-based policy that ensure that it applies in the majority of cases; a "close enough" rule that allows us to eat the occasional loss while still benefiting overall.

    Of course, we can't have programs like that because people would insist on "equal rights" for English and PE majors.

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    The government should pay for college when it is statistically likely to lead to a greater increase in tax revenues than the expense of the program. Since we can't judge that on a case-by-case basis, we need a rules-based policy that ensure that it applies in the majority of cases; a "close enough" rule that allows us to eat the occasional loss while still benefiting overall.

    Of course, we can't have programs like that because people would insist on "equal rights" for English and PE majors.
    Finally, someone who is on the same page as me, LOL!

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir
    The government should pay for college when it is statistically likely to lead to a greater increase in tax revenues than the expense of the program. Since we can't judge that on a case-by-case basis, we need a rules-based policy that ensure that it applies in the majority of cases; a "close enough" rule that allows us to eat the occasional loss while still benefiting overall.

    Of course, we can't have programs like that because people would insist on "equal rights" for English and PE majors.
    I think the thing you have to keep in mind with something like this is that literature and physical education have beneficial effects in society that probably do result in more productivity, which in turn should result in higher tax revenues. But those effects are both necessary and indirect. To give one example: Jung pointed out that people need myths and stories in order to live their lives in some coherent manner. If you understand what he was talking about, you realize that of course he was right. Literature is important because it is one main source of those stories, and arguably the most salutary source.

    In general, and with a few exceptions, I think most things that human beings do in society contribute something beneficial and necessary to that society.

    I'm more of the opinion that education ought to be free to all to a certain point (say, master's level certification). Ph.D. candidates in overstuffed professions (like, for instance, English Lit Education) ought to have to meet certain justificatory standards before they get to move forward, whereas Ph.D. candidates in badly needed professions (like, for instance, architects, doctors, geologists, etc) ought to get funding for education more easily and perhaps even incentives.

    There also needs to be some protection against someone gaming the system. There are some problems that might justify some great genius getting four Ph.Ds. But for most folk, one is enough.
    Last edited by ashurbanipal; 01-19-12 at 09:05 AM.

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Should everyone have access to all types of college education and degrees regardless of their financial status and should the only factor that should be considered when allowing access to college education and degrees be their ability to complete such academic curriculum?

    Or should only those who can afford a college education or those select few who receive scholarships be allowed access to college education and thus, one’s financial status should be considered in addition to one’s ability to complete academic curriculum?

    What option did you pick or which one best reflects your beliefs and why?
    When you say "free" you actually mean "tax-payer funded", because it costs something even if the student isn't the one paying the bill. In which case, I would base funding off of academic performance.

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Should everyone have access to all types of college education and degrees regardless of their financial status and should the only factor that should be considered when allowing access to college education and degrees be their ability to complete such academic curriculum?

    Or should only those who can afford a college education or those select few who receive scholarships be allowed access to college education and thus, one’s financial status should be considered in addition to one’s ability to complete academic curriculum?

    What option did you pick or which one best reflects your beliefs and why?
    First, this is a faulty premise. With few exceptions, anyone that is ABLE to attend college CAN attend college. You may not be able to attend the exact college you want (but then agian, no one has that garaunteed ability). You may have to take on debt or you may have to work extra hours in prepping for it. However, even without scholarships and without financial support from family, it is absolutely and unquestionable possible for nearly anyone that can get accepted to a college to be able to afford to go to that college. The question of course is the desire and/or need for college large enough that they're willing to take on debt, reduce their free time and take on extra jobs, and/or narrow their choices to the most economically feasible (Such as 2 years at a community college and then 2 years at a small state school as opposed to 4 years at a private institution).

    Second, no. The moment you start making college paid for in full through tax payer funds (By the way, that is not "free") then you begin to establish a belief that it is a "right" that people attend college. Once you establish that you begin to create at atmosphere where the difficulty regarding the entry into and standards of college could be reduced. You create a situation, one where sadly going towards already, where college is not HIGHER education but simply "High School Part II". You devalue the notion of a bachelors degree, you extend the "adolecense" cycle by watering down the college experience and making it more wide spread, and essentially move things forward so that this same conversation begins about master's degree's in 10 to 20 years.

    No, college should not be paid for in full by the government.

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    Absolutely not. College is a path traveled to meet certain ends in your life. Government funded college to achieve those ends is an attempt to create more equal 'ends', not equal opportunities. The idea of government-funded college is beyond the ideal role of the government.
    Last edited by fredmertz; 01-19-12 at 12:31 PM.

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    I think there should be affordable college. It is a violation of equal opportunity to make colleges so expensive that only kids with rich parents can attend.
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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I think there should be affordable college. It is a violation of equal opportunity to make colleges so expensive that only kids with rich parents can attend.
    It is a violation of PRIVATE colleges to be mandated what they can or cannot charge. It is not a violation of equal opportunity to increase costs for a product that is in high demand. If people are willing to pay for it and the college can remain profitable, what right does anyone have to interrupt this transaction?

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    Re: Should “equal opportunity” mean free college?

    "Free" college doesn't create equal opportunity. Education deficits exist long before students reach college age, first of all. Secondly, as long as we have majors with little guarantee of broad-ranging success (i.e. women's studies, dance) we shouldn't be requiring tax payers to subsidize the whims of any college-age person in this country.

    Secondly, as somebody already mentioned, it's already possible for most people to go to college if they can gain acceptance. "Equal opportunity" shouldn't mean "make everything as easy and challenge-free as possible". People need to work for what they want. Challenge and competition breed successful, capable people. If we start handing things to people left and right we have a lot of people who never learn the necessary skills for survival and success.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


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