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Thread: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

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    what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    I won't post it as a voting poll, but just list the issues that you would rather seen handled by state governments than the Federal government. Here are mine:

    • marijuana (for medicinal or recreational use)
    • the sale of sexual services (often derisively known as prostitution)
    • marriage, especially gay marriage

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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    I'd rather list the areas where the federal government should have a role (in random order).

    1. Education
    2. Public health, safety, defense (including healthcare, anti-terrorism and environmental law)
    3. Foreign affairs (military and diplomacy)
    4. Civil Rights
    5. Interstate economics

    The state can legislate on top of all these areas. Everything else can be handled solely by the states.
    (avatar by Thomas Nast)

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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    I'd like most things to be under state control with a general Constitutional framework of what is legal and not. I think most of our welfare state should be state run and issued. I think Federal control over a lot of things is too complex and difficult to be undertaken with any kind of success. Seems easier to have 50 individuals work on the details than one big dumb guy, no?

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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    I don't care about States' rights. There is right and there is wrong. If the government does wrong or seeks to prevent me from doing right, it doesn't matter which government it is.

    All three of the issues in the OP are things I think the government must be involved in.

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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    All three of the issues in the OP are things I think the government must be involved in.
    What don't you think the government should be involved in?

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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    I won't post it as a voting poll, but just list the issues that you would rather seen handled by state governments than the Federal government. Here are mine:

    • marijuana (for medicinal or recreational use)
    • the sale of sexual services (often derisively known as prostitution)
    • marriage, especially gay marriage
    What I think should be handled by the states:
    -Health & safety
    -Law enforcement
    -Education
    -Welfare

    What I think should be handled by the federal government:
    -Military
    -Commerce between the states & with foreign countries
    -Post offices & interstate highways

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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Luna Tick View Post
    the sale of sexual services (often derisively known as prostitution)
    That is one I think I've changed my mind on recently. I agree, in theory, with the idea that if somebody wants to sell sex that isn't the government's business. But we had a speaker at my law school last year that had worked for a women's shelter for 35 years, largely doing outreach to prostitutes that gave a pretty compelling counter argument. Her take is that prostitution is largely slavery. Not in some hippie dippie sense of treating women's bodies like property, but literal slavery. The vast majority of prostitutes started before they reached 15. The ran away from home and a predatory pimp found them, maybe they were even kidnapped or shipped here from another country where their family was threatened if they didn't comply. The pimp systematically gained control over them through violence, drugs, threats and manipulation to the point where they at least believe that they really have no choice.

    So, the obvious response is that statutory rape and slavery are illegal, so we could just prosecute them for that without having to make prostitution illegal. But practically speaking that doesn't really work. A woman who is, for example, severely addicted to heroin and whose only source is her pimp, whose pimp has her kids while she's out, and whose pimp regularly beats her and her kids just is not realistically going to go to the police to report it and even if somebody else reports it, she isn't going to testify in court against him. Or, with statutory rape, it is much harder to prove. Police can't solicit statutory rape because the john is the perpetrator. Neither the john nor the victim are ever going to report it. Even if somebody does report it, that just allows the police to go after the john, it doesn't empower them to do anything to help the girl out of her situation. So, from a practical point of view, the only real way to fight it is to make the whole profession illegal.

    I'm not 100% convinced, but that definitely gave me a lot to think about on the topic.

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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    The Middle East and Gulf Region
    Religion
    States rights
    Home Land Security
    business, oil, and farm subsidies
    the regulation of media

    and what Luna said










    "When Faith preaches Hate, Blessed are the Doubters." - Amin Maalouf

    When trouble arises and things look bad, there is always one individual who perceives a solution and is willing to take command. Very often, that person is crazy. ~Dave Barry



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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    Quote Originally Posted by Krhazy View Post
    I'd rather list the areas where the federal government should have a role (in random order).

    1. Education
    2. Public health, safety, defense (including healthcare, anti-terrorism and environmental law)
    3. Foreign affairs (military and diplomacy)
    4. Civil Rights
    5. Interstate economics

    The state can legislate on top of all these areas. Everything else can be handled solely by the states.
    Pretty much everything on the list is authorized by the Constitution.

    You'd need an Amendment to do Education though.... despite what we seem to have allowed for the last several decades with "The Department of Education"
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    Re: what are your "Federal government butt out" issues?

    Quote Originally Posted by teamosil View Post
    That is one I think I've changed my mind on recently. I agree, in theory, with the idea that if somebody wants to sell sex that isn't the government's business. But we had a speaker at my law school last year that had worked for a women's shelter for 35 years, largely doing outreach to prostitutes that gave a pretty compelling counter argument. Her take is that prostitution is largely slavery. Not in some hippie dippie sense of treating women's bodies like property, but literal slavery. The vast majority of prostitutes started before they reached 15. The ran away from home and a predatory pimp found them, maybe they were even kidnapped or shipped here from another country where their family was threatened if they didn't comply. The pimp systematically gained control over them through violence, drugs, threats and manipulation to the point where they at least believe that they really have no choice.

    So, the obvious response is that statutory rape and slavery are illegal, so we could just prosecute them for that without having to make prostitution illegal. But practically speaking that doesn't really work. A woman who is, for example, severely addicted to heroin and whose only source is her pimp, whose pimp has her kids while she's out, and whose pimp regularly beats her and her kids just is not realistically going to go to the police to report it and even if somebody else reports it, she isn't going to testify in court against him. Or, with statutory rape, it is much harder to prove. Police can't solicit statutory rape because the john is the perpetrator. Neither the john nor the victim are ever going to report it. Even if somebody does report it, that just allows the police to go after the john, it doesn't empower them to do anything to help the girl out of her situation. So, from a practical point of view, the only real way to fight it is to make the whole profession illegal.

    I'm not 100% convinced, but that definitely gave me a lot to think about on the topic.
    I'm completely against sexual slavery too. However, what you describe is really the result of illegal prostitution. It doesn't describe the legal brothels in Nevada. When it's legal and regulated, we avoid almost all the problems that happen with illegal prostitution. In the legal brothels, you don't have sex workers beholden to a pimp and forced to work. It's a case as in any other profession where a worker can choose to work or to quit and do something else. It's a case of consenting adults choosing to have sex. The only difference is it's done as a paid service. Even if you did find a pimp tyrant at a particular legal venue, it's one that should be shut down for not adhering to the regulations. I salute your desire to keep women safe. However, legalization is one way to accomplish that.

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