View Poll Results: How should Marijuana be dealt with?

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  • Stricter federal laws must be made, and more money put to enforcing them

    13 10.83%
  • Give individual states the right to decide how to go about it

    39 32.50%
  • Legalize it through a federal law

    52 43.33%
  • Give states the right to decide about it as long as they abide by certain Federal guidelines

    16 13.33%
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Thread: Marijuana

  1. #291
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    Re: Marijuna

    Quote Originally Posted by fredmertz View Post
    This is a prime example of a strawman argument. They claim legalizing drugs would reduce consumption of drugs. You claim then that legalizing homicide or anything illegal would reduce murders or anything that we made legal. You've extremely twisted their point. They're talking about drugs specifically. You're the one talking about everything else.

    Don't get me wrong, I don't THINK it would reduce consumption. But I can't stand by and let you build an argument on such a twisted premise that only you have stated.
    Then the notion of "legalizing something will decrease the occurence of said something" isn't absolute?

    Why?

    I understand the drugs part, but I want to know if/where that logic applies to other currently illegal things.


    Furthermore, I never claimed that. I was wondering if that logic would apply to murders/theft, as well.
    Last edited by Wake; 01-11-12 at 03:07 PM.

  2. #292
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    Ontologuy's Avatar
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    Re: Marijuna

    Another "legalize pot" thread.

    Is there anything left to say that hasn't already been said on the matter?

    Is it now just different people saying the same old thing?

    What's new here?
    You don't trust Trump? Well, there's only one way to leverage him to do what's economically right for us all: Powerful American Political Alliance. Got courage?! .. and a mere $5.00?

  3. #293
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    Re: Marijuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Ontologuy View Post
    Another "legalize pot" thread.

    Is there anything left to say that hasn't already been said on the matter?

    Is it now just different people saying the same old thing?

    What's new here?
    This can apply, I think, to most political fissures from abortion to marriage.

  4. #294
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    Re: Marijuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    Marijuana - InfoFacts - NIDA

    Are you saying that study trumps these .gov websites?
    Two things:

    1. The study in the NYT article was a government-funded study with a higher sample group.
    2. The most recent resource cited on the page you linked is from 2008, where as the NYT article is from 2011.

    Newer data from a larger sample is probably what I'd go with in almost all situations.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


  5. #295
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    Re: Marijuna

    Ten percent support the status quo, still live in the past, still are against ...dare I say ...freedoms and liberty..
    The states must take the responsibility, and they must determine what works and what does not, and then this info must be shared...
    It must be known, by now, that prohibition does not work, never has, never will.
    And, even as I support the right of the masses to grow and use this crap, I would never use it myself....nor would I walk into a burning building.
    Others feel differently about this, which must be respected.
    Its now eleven percent.. but must we continue to have a minority "run things" ???
    Last edited by earthworm; 01-11-12 at 03:15 PM.

  6. #296
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    Re: Marijuna

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Two things:

    1. The study in the NYT article was a government-funded study with a higher sample group.
    2. The most recent resource cited on the page you linked is from 2008, where as the NYT article is from 2011.

    Newer data from a larger sample is probably what I'd go with in almost all situations.
    ...interesting. Though I distrust the NYT for their blatant bias I'll consider the scientific data itself.

  7. #297
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    Re: Marijuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    I realise there are plenty of ways conservatism has changed. On the other hand it is hard for me to understand a conservatism that doesn't recognise man as a social, cultural and imaginative animal and simply views him as the same atomistic and antisocial way as any classical or modern liberal. I can understand you taking a different position on prohibition, though I didn't really have you in my Tessa, I do not believe in alcohol or marijuana prohibition, but I cannot understand you doing so for reasons that are very unconservative and seem identical to the staunchest social liberals on the board.
    Will people ever stop with this stupid straw-man argument that gets flung at Liberals and Libertarians? No one says that a man is an island. He simply is not a cog in a machine. People have the right and ability to react to society and find their place in it. The government does not need to be there to wipe crap from our bottoms or dress us. People are social and largely moral, not because someone makes them do it, but because they want to be. You've been talking in abstracts, and I have not seen any evidence of "moral decay" (whatever the hell that is) in places where prostitution is legal. Meanwhile, we do know that allowing people to engage in vices that you don't like (and, in this case, I don't really like either) but don't violate anyone's rights tends to reduce harm to society and the people involved in those vices
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    Re: Marijuna

    I think I'm going to make a new poll on marijuana. NOT about legality, but about the effect on the body, regarding that link Winston provided. If no one can offer updated data to counter the research in that article, then I have no real choic but to accept it as currently correct.

  9. #299
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    Re: Marijuna

    Quote Originally Posted by DrunkenAsparagus View Post
    Will people ever stop with this stupid straw-man argument that gets flung at Liberals and Libertarians? No one says that a man is an island. He simply is not a cog in a machine. People have the right and ability to react to society and find their place in it. The government does not need to be there to wipe crap from our bottoms or dress us. People are social and largely moral, not because someone makes them do it, but because they want to be. You've been talking in abstracts, and I have not seen any evidence of "moral decay" (whatever the hell that is) in places where prostitution is legal. Meanwhile, we do know that allowing people to engage in vices that you don't like (and, in this case, I don't really like either) but don't violate anyone's rights tends to reduce harm to society and the people involved in those vices
    Do you find it ironic that some on the right would stand and demand more "personal accountability" when it comes to financial solvency but would just as willingly try to regulate private, personal behavior for the "common good"?
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


  10. #300
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    Re: Marijuna

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    Marijuana - InfoFacts - NIDA

    Are you saying that study trumps these .gov websites?
    Are you referring to the same NIDA that once stated this "fact" in their "Facts parents need to know" publication?

    •The risk of using cocaine is estimated to be more than 104 times greater for those who have tried marijuana than for those who have never tried it.
    here is this so called fact in its full context that they cherry picked and played loose with. notice any omissions or distortion of the actual truth of this "fact"?

    The Center on Addiction and Substance Abuse at Columbia (CASA) released a study Oct. 27 showing that children (12 to 17 years old) who use gateway drugs--tobacco, alcohol and marijuana--are up to 266 times--and adults who use such drugs are up to 323 times--more likely to use cocaine than those who don't use any gateway drugs. Compared with people who used only one gateway drug, children who used all three are 77 times--and adults are 104 times--more likely to use cocaine.
    so adults who use all three of tobacco, alcohol and marijuana are 104 times more likey to use cocaine, but when it comes to NIDA and their "facts" it suddenly becomes just marijuana, and the other 2 necessary components behind this figure come up missing.

    NIDA plays very loose with their "facts" and distorts and misrepresents them for the sake of propaganda. They have no credibility despite the .gov. But of course.. you know the gov is infallible, why would they lie to us?
    Last edited by marduc; 01-11-12 at 03:34 PM.
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