Thread: Is allowing a temporary tax cut to expire raising taxes

Originally Posted by misterman

As an analogy - if you only know you're going faster than you were a minute ago, that doesn't tell you if you're speeding.

Here's another analogy.

Congress passes a law to reduce he rate of spending growth and calls that a spending cut.

Originally Posted by PerfectStorm

Here's another analogy.

Congress passes a law to reduce he rate of spending growth and calls that a spending cut.

That is an entirely different scenario from what we're discussing, however. A lower rate of increase is not a "cut". An increase in tax rates is an increase. A lower rate of increase is still an increase. Your example is dishonest accounting whereas an honest assessment of the scenario given at the start of this thread is simply inconvenient verbiage for those who don't support the extension of existing policy.

Originally Posted by Blackstone

A lower rate of increase is not a "cut".

Tell that to the congress critters who are trying to sell it as a cut. (See Deficit Reduction Committee).

No, it's obviously not raising taxes. It's allowing a temporary measure to lower taxes in order to gain political capital to expire as planned, returning taxes to normal levels. The entire "lower taxes" schtick was a political ploy meant to curry favor with voters, knowing that another president would have to deal with the blowback when the expiration date arrived. In other words, it was a cheap shot that unfortunately had a gullible audience unable to recognize that they were being manipulated, and there would be future consequences to their fiscal myopia.

Yes, it is raising taxes. Democrats should just own up to it, the spinning is unnecessary.

Originally Posted by DiAnna

No, it's obviously not raising taxes. It's allowing a temporary measure to lower taxes in order to gain political capital to expire as planned, returning taxes to normal levels. The entire "lower taxes" schtick was a political ploy meant to curry favor with voters, knowing that another president would have to deal with the blowback when the expiration date arrived. In other words, it was a cheap shot that unfortunately had a gullible audience unable to recognize that they were being manipulated, and there would be future consequences to their fiscal myopia.

you do know that the income tax was sold as a temporary measure

the normal state is no income taxes. Clinton raised taxes, Bush lowered them, Obama wants to raise them only on a minority voting bloc

Originally Posted by jamesrage

Do your taxes go up or down after a tax cut you got is allowed to expire? They do go up and as a result you are paying more taxes.Therefore it is a tax increase.

If all these people the 46% who do not pay federal income taxes lost all the deductions and had to pay 10,15 or 25 percent or more depending on what income tax bracket they fell into, would these people's taxes go up?

46 Percent of Americans Exempt From Federal Income Tax in 2011
Tax Brackets (Federal Income Tax Rates) 2000 through 2011

Actually 86% of americans pay a positive tax rate. Nice talking points.

Originally Posted by DiAnna

No, it's obviously not raising taxes. It's allowing a temporary measure to lower taxes in order to gain political capital to expire as planned, returning taxes to normal levels. The entire "lower taxes" schtick was a political ploy meant to curry favor with voters, knowing that another president would have to deal with the blowback when the expiration date arrived. In other words, it was a cheap shot that unfortunately had a gullible audience unable to recognize that they were being manipulated, and there would be future consequences to their fiscal myopia.

Would you say the same thing if all the tax deductions and credits people received expired? That would mean the 47% who do not pay federal income taxes would suddenly state paying federal income taxes

Look at it like a sale in a retail store. If the price of an item is $39.99, then that's the price. If it goes on sale for a week for $29.99, the regular price is still $39.99, but you're temporarily able to get it for ten dollars less. At the end of the sale, it's not a price hike. The regular price was $39.99 all along. There was only a temporary discount. The same is true of a temporary tax decrease. Therefore, allowing a temporary tax cut to expire is not raising taxes. It expires on its own without the legislators doing anything. An actual tax increase requires that they have to actively choose to increase taxes.

Originally Posted by Luna Tick

Look at it like a sale in a retail store. If the price of an item is $39.99, then that's the price. If it goes on sale for a week for $29.99, the regular price is still $39.99, but you're temporarily able to get it for ten dollars less. At the end of the sale, it's not a price hike. The regular price was $39.99 all along. There was only a temporary discount. The same is true of a temporary tax decrease. Therefore, allowing a temporary tax cut to expire is not raising taxes. It expires on its own without the legislators doing anything. An actual tax increase requires that they have to actively choose to increase taxes.

I am pretty sure that if the 47% who do not pay federal income taxes suddenly lost those tax credits and deductions every lib would be screaming bloody murder that you are raising their taxes.