• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Is the System Broken or are People at Fault or Both?

Is the System Broken are People at Fault or Both??

  • Total voters
    42
iliveonramen said:
This isn't the first time that this has happened and probably won't be the last. I think it's more a human nature issue of repeating past mistakes.

Guidelines are created and checks on corporate influence and people after decades of having those protections begin to forget why they were put there in the first place and self interested groups start making the argument to rip away those protections...and then everybody is back to a corrupt government ran on money....then eventually they get fed up and do something....and put in new guidelines and checks and repeater.
Click to expand...


The reason humans keep repeating their mistakes is because each new generation can't learn from their predecessors, you have to live it. My parents taught me right from wrong but I still had to learn later for myself. But we are still evolving and hopefully don't start to devolve or get wiped out.
 
grip said:
There is obviously a growing problem in today's politics. Whether it's a disconnect with candidates and elected officials or disenfranchised voters. The US government is IMO one of the most fair systems of governing ever devised in human history. Yet somehow we're seeing a growing corruption within. Is it from indefinite term limits, creating cronyism and career politicians? Is it from virtually unlimited candidate funding, allowing groups of concentrated wealth influence peddling? Is it the lobby's who through unimpeded access gain inside favoritism and no-bid contracts? Is it Party or Partisan Politics unable to compromise relying on ideology more than practical reasoning? I'm curious is it our system of governing that's flawed or are our people too self interested or a little of both? Let the debate begin.
Click to expand...

It's not that our system is broken.

Rather, it's outdated.

We should not be using an 18th century system in a 21st century society.
 
samsmart said:
It's not that our system is broken.

Rather, it's outdated.

We should not be using an 18th century system in a 21st century society.
Click to expand...

Exactly what part of the Constitution do you view as outdated?
 
samsmart said:
It's not that our system is broken.

Rather, it's outdated.

We should not be using an 18th century system in a 21st century society.
Click to expand...


It's both outdated and abused. People are devious and slick enough to undermine any system given the time and resources.
 
grip said:
It's both outdated and abused. People are devious and slick enough to undermine any system given the time and resources.
Click to expand...

Same question for you as was posed in post #53...
 
AlabamaPaul said:
Same question for you as was posed in post #53...
Click to expand...

Where have I criticized the Constitution specifically? The US government is far more involved and convoluted than just it's founding documents.
 
grip said:
Where have I criticized the Constitution specifically? The US government is far more involved and convoluted than just it's founding documents.
Click to expand...

Your post stated our form of government was outdated, and that form of government is based ,supposedly, on the US Constitution...
 
AlabamaPaul said:
Your post stated our form of government was outdated, and that form of government is based ,supposedly, on the US Constitution...
Click to expand...

It's outdated in so many ways in need of Social Security, Medicare and Welfare reform. The countries infrastructure isn't being kept up to date. There are way too many departments, especially with the attitude of spend the entire budget or get cut next year. FEMA is el stinko pants and the Defense department is loaded with a bunch of bloated, unnecessary programs. Who couldn't go on and on?
 
grip said:
It's outdated in so many ways in need of Social Security, Medicare and Welfare reform. The countries infrastructure isn't being kept up to date. There are way too many departments, especially with the attitude of spend the entire budget or get cut next year. FEMA is el stinko pants and the Defense department is loaded with a bunch of bloated, unnecessary programs. Who couldn't go on and on?
Click to expand...

None of thesse have to do with the Constitution or our form of government. It only goes to show just how far we have moved away from the country's founding...
 
AlabamaPaul said:
None of thesse have to do with the Constitution or our form of government. It only goes to show just how far we have moved away from the country's founding...
Click to expand...

And I never criticized the Constitution, nor have you showed where I have. Our form of governing has been accessorized with departmental abuses and faults thru each branch with the points I've mentioned. This current gov has grown far beyond in scope and intrusion than what the founding fathers ever envisioned. You simply draw false inferences to support your opinion about my post.
 
AlabamaPaul said:
Exactly what part of the Constitution do you view as outdated?
Click to expand...

Should freedom of speech apply to corporations which can pay for television commercials which they hired child psychologists to design? Can 4 year olds deal with that? There was no television and Freudian psychology in 1776.

psik
 
grip said:
And I never criticized the Constitution, nor have you showed where I have. Our form of governing has been accessorized with departmental abuses and faults thru each branch with the points I've mentioned. This current gov has grown far beyond in scope and intrusion than what the founding fathers ever envisioned. You simply draw false inferences to support your opinion about my post.
Click to expand...

samsmart said:
It's not that our system is broken.

Rather, it's outdated.

We should not be using an 18th century system in a 21st century society.
Click to expand...

You both agreed with and "liked" samsmart's post, and I take that as being critical of the Constitution. Did I misunderstand your viewpoint?
 
psikeyhackr said:
Should freedom of speech apply to corporations which can pay for television commercials which they hired child psychologists to design? Can 4 year olds deal with that? There was no television and Freudian psychology in 1776.

psik
Click to expand...

What corporations are running political ads?
 
Let's be honest, the system is a little bit broken in my opinion, but in the end, the people are the ones that fuel that. I think that we simply don't have enough educated voters to capitalize on the fairly sound political system we have. If we did, there would certainly be more moderate and balanced politics. One thing I don't like about the political system is the barring of 3rd parties from debates. That seems to partially be limiting the peoples ability to vote effectively. All in all though, if we are to get out of this situation we need to educate our voters. Not just on conservative and liberal policy, but on bi-partisan ones as well.
 
psikeyhackr said:
Should freedom of speech apply to corporations which can pay for television commercials which they hired child psychologists to design? There was no television and Freudian psychology in 1776.

psik
Click to expand...

Is this an example of an outdated constitution or a current disadvantage for your favorite party?
 
AlabamaPaul said:
You both agreed with and "liked" samsmart's post, and I take that as being critical of the Constitution. Did I misunderstand your viewpoint?
Click to expand...


You misstated what was said several times. Nobody ever mentioned the Constitution or the principles the country was founded on. There are problems with the way the US government is governing in our opinion. You don't agree, fine who cares? Most people think there are flaws in the current gov.
 
grip said:
You misstated what was said several times. Nobody ever mentioned the Constitution or the principles the country was founded on. There are problems with the way the US government is governing in our opinion. You don't agree, fine who cares? Most people think there are flaws in the current gov.
Click to expand...

I don't see where I misstated anything when asking about your agreement with this statement:

"We should not be using an 18th century system in a 21st century society."

By agreeing, you are certainly criticizing our Constitutional form of government.
 
iacardsfan said:
Let's be honest, the system is a little bit broken in my opinion, but in the end, the people are the ones that fuel that. I think that we simply don't have enough educated voters to capitalize on the fairly sound political system we have. If we did, there would certainly be more moderate and balanced politics. One thing I don't like about the political system is the barring of 3rd parties from debates. That seems to partially be limiting the peoples ability to vote effectively. All in all though, if we are to get out of this situation we need to educate our voters. Not just on conservative and liberal policy, but on bi-partisan ones as well.
Click to expand...

I don't know that I would necessarily call it broken.

I think it's more that we allowed a scenario where people who pay nothing into the system have begun voting themselves other people's money and believe a minimum income tax would fix that.
 
Dapper Andy said:
I don't know that I would necessarily call it broken.

I think it's more that we allowed a scenario where people who pay nothing into the system have begun voting themselves other people's money and believe a minimum income tax would fix that.
Click to expand...
I only believe the broken system is seen when it comes to the debates. Obviously debating was never outlined as law or such, but i still think it is necessary for all voters to see all candidates, not just a Republican and a Democrat.
 
Dapper Andy said:
Is this an example of an outdated constitution or a current disadvantage for your favorite party?
Click to expand...

I would say, an outdated constitution. Speech may have applied to newspapers back then but how many 4 year olds were reading them? Television is different and has not been pervasive for even 70 years. But it is a kind of uncontrolled experiment on society.

Now what will tablet computers do? Will this provide more parent control?

psik
 
AlabamaPaul said:
I don't see where I misstated anything when asking about your agreement with this statement:

"We should not be using an 18th century system in a 21st century society."

By agreeing, you are certainly criticizing our Constitutional form of government.
Click to expand...


You missed the part of my response to that post where I only agreed to it being outdated. Then I responded to you which parts I thought were outdated and flawed.

You can try and infer anything you please it doesn't make you right, just makes you someone who's trying to put words in my mouth that I never said. There's a term for that. If you go to my OP you'll see where I said, "The US government is IMO one of the most fair systems of governing ever devised in human history."

Maybe you want to read a little more of the thread before making things up? ;)
 
grip said:
You missed the part of my response to that post where I only agreed to it being outdated. Then I responded to you which parts I thought were outdated and flawed.

You can try and infer anything you please it doesn't make you right, just makes you someone who's trying to put words in my mouth that I never said. There's a term for that. If you go to my OP you'll see where I said, "The US government is IMO one of the most fair systems of governing ever devised in human history."

Maybe you want to read a little more of the thread before making things up? ;)
Click to expand...

All you would have needed to do was to say this in response to the question. Instead, you went on the defensive and felt as if I was in some way attacking you personally...
 
iacardsfan said:
I only believe the broken system is seen when it comes to the debates. Obviously debating was never outlined as law or such, but i still think it is necessary for all voters to see all candidates, not just a Republican and a Democrat.
Click to expand...

I think that's a bi-product of such a divided tax base.

Those who pay less want more and those who pay more want less.

It has led to radical political parties and no room for the middle ground.
 
psikeyhackr said:
I would say, an outdated constitution. Speech may have applied to newspapers back then but how many 4 year olds were reading them? Television is different and has not been pervasive for even 70 years. But it is a kind of uncontrolled experiment on society.

Now what will tablet computers do? Will this provide more parent control?

psik
Click to expand...

I'm not sure what any of that has to do with freedom of speech though.
 
AlabamaPaul said:
All you would have needed to do was to say this in response to the question. Instead, you went on the defensive and felt as if I was in some way attacking you personally...
Click to expand...

My apologies if you felt attacked. I was trying to respond to an accusation that I didn't approve of the US Constitution, which I do.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom