View Poll Results: Is the OWS Movement against Capitalism?

Voters
96. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    50 52.08%
  • No

    41 42.71%
  • I don't know

    5 5.21%
Page 27 of 54 FirstFirst ... 17252627282937 ... LastLast
Results 261 to 270 of 531

Thread: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

  1. #261
    Disappointed Evolutionist
    Catawba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Last Seen
    05-28-13 @ 08:15 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    27,254

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Out sourcing obviously is a problem and has been for decades. Tariffs on those companies would solve the problem.
    Do you support the bill to end subsidies to companies outsourcing jobs?

    "WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) — Companies would get a break on payroll taxes for creating new jobs in the United States under a bill coming up for a vote in the Senate this week.

    To get relief from the employer share of the Social Security payroll tax, companies would have to certify that a new U.S. worker is replacing an employee who’d been working overseas.

    "Introduced last week by Sen. Dick Durbin, an Illinois Democrat, the bill also would end subsidies for firms that move facilities abroad."

    Senate Democrats target job outsourcing - MarketWatch
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  2. #262
    Sage
    Mycroft's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:37 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    25,833

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    No you haven't. You've posted links showing that Adbusters was involved with catalyzing the movement, which is also mentioned, in greater detail, in the first article I linked in my last post. If you read that article, you'll notice that practically the very first thing that happened at the initial gathering is that there was friction between the die hard anarchist Adbuster fans, and the other group involved. The other thing you'll notice is that basically none of the people who are influential with the NY General Assembly have anything to do with Adbusters.

    So, you've really got to ask yourself, if this is an Adbusters movement, why do they have no control over what is happening, and why does OWS not actually support their politics, in general (which you'd have noticed by now, if you weren't dead set on dismissing the entire movement as useful idiots)?
    You didn't read all my links. Furthermore, the links I provided are not all of the information available concerning Adbuster's control and direction of OWS...it was a starting point for a member's research. Perhaps you need to do some research as well.
    TANSTAAFL

    “An armed society is a polite society.”
    ― Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon

  3. #263
    Guru
    Aderleth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Seen
    04-08-16 @ 06:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    4,294

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    You didn't read all my links. Furthermore, the links I provided are not all of the information available concerning Adbuster's control and direction of OWS...it was a starting point for a member's research. Perhaps you need to do some research as well.
    I did read all your links. They don't really say what you're claiming they say. The reinforce the facts (that I freely admit) that Adbusters had a hand in creating the seed for OWS (although the wikipedia entry has some bad info on how that went down), and that Adbusters is an anti-capitalist group. None of your links say much of anything about how influential Adbusters is in the movement at the moment. By contrast, if you look at the info I provided you a couple of pages ago, you'll find that it does lead to some conclusions on that point. Conclusions you're not going to like.

  4. #264
    Electrician
    Bob Blaylock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    North 38°28′ West 121°26′
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 01:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    13,745

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    In somewhat-related news, I saw on the TV news today, during my break at work, a story about a local “medical” marijuana dispensary that is going out of business. Supposedly, they are going to be holding some event in which they are going to give out their remaining inventory for free.

    It has occurred to me that if the Sacramento police would like to temporarily clear Chavez park of the vermin that are currently “occupying” it, that a very easy way to do so would be to spread word there about this event. Surely, no OccuVermin would pass up the chance at free pot.
    The five great lies of the Left Wrong:
    We can be Godless and free. • “Social justice” through forced redistribution of wealth. • Silencing religious opinions counts as “diversity”. • Freedom without moral and personal responsibility. • Civilization can survive the intentional undermining of the family.

  5. #265
    Sage
    Mycroft's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:37 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    25,833

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    I did read all your links. They don't really say what you're claiming they say. The reinforce the facts (that I freely admit) that Adbusters had a hand in creating the seed for OWS (although the wikipedia entry has some bad info on how that went down), and that Adbusters is an anti-capitalist group. None of your links say much of anything about how influential Adbusters is in the movement at the moment. By contrast, if you look at the info I provided you a couple of pages ago, you'll find that it does lead to some conclusions on that point. Conclusions you're not going to like.
    Your links only show that individual useful idiots may or may not even be aware of Adbusters...that individual useful idiots may or may not be aware of the influence Adbusters has on the course and direction of the movement. But if you read the blog entries from Adbusters, themselves, it's very easy to see that what they propose in their blogs...happens. So, even though individual useful idiots may think they are directing their own course...they are not.
    TANSTAAFL

    “An armed society is a polite society.”
    ― Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon

  6. #266
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    The greatest city on Earth
    Last Seen
    08-04-12 @ 04:27 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    31,089

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Blaylock View Post
    In somewhat-related news, I saw on the TV news today, during my break at work, a story about a local “medical” marijuana dispensary that is going out of business. Supposedly, they are going to be holding some event in which they are going to give out their remaining inventory for free.

    It has occurred to me that if the Sacramento police would like to temporarily clear Chavez park of the vermin that are currently “occupying” it, that a very easy way to do so would be to spread word there about this event. Surely, no OccuVermin would pass up the chance at free pot.
    or free food.

  7. #267
    Anti political parties
    FreedomFromAll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    New Mexico USA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,040

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Do you support the bill to end subsidies to companies outsourcing jobs?

    "WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) — Companies would get a break on payroll taxes for creating new jobs in the United States under a bill coming up for a vote in the Senate this week.

    To get relief from the employer share of the Social Security payroll tax, companies would have to certify that a new U.S. worker is replacing an employee who’d been working overseas.

    "Introduced last week by Sen. Dick Durbin, an Illinois Democrat, the bill also would end subsidies for firms that move facilities abroad."

    Senate Democrats target job outsourcing - MarketWatch
    Yes I support it. I think it could be better but when you read what the opposition rational, I think anything is better than what they assert:
    “Replacing a job that is based in another country with a domestic job does not stimulate economic growth or enhance the competitiveness of American worldwide companies,” wrote Bruce Josten, the Chamber’s vice president for government affairs, in a letter to senators last week.
    Basically the Chamber is asserting that Americans dont need jobs. Either way one could spin that it is ****ed up.

  8. #268
    Guru
    Aderleth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Seen
    04-08-16 @ 06:26 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    4,294

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    Your links only show that individual useful idiots may or may not even be aware of Adbusters...that individual useful idiots may or may not be aware of the influence Adbusters has on the course and direction of the movement. But if you read the blog entries from Adbusters, themselves, it's very easy to see that what they propose in their blogs...happens. So, even though individual useful idiots may think they are directing their own course...they are not.
    Bull****. If you read the first article I posted, you'll see, first, that the very first thing that happened after Adbusters initiated a meeting with another organization is that there was friction between the two. You'd also notice that the leadership of the general assembly in New York has basically no ties to Adbusters. You're engaged in a very sad attempt at wishful thinking right now.

  9. #269
    Anti political parties
    FreedomFromAll's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    New Mexico USA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,040

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    Bull****. If you read the first article I posted, you'll see, first, that the very first thing that happened after Adbusters initiated a meeting with another organization is that there was friction between the two. You'd also notice that the leadership of the general assembly in New York has basically no ties to Adbusters. You're engaged in a very sad attempt at wishful thinking right now.
    Thats not exactly accurate.

    David Graeber: On Playing By The Rules On August 2, I showed up at a 7 PM meeting at Bowling Green, that a Greek anarchist friend, who I’d met at a recent activist get together at 16 Beaver Street, had told me was meant to plan some kind of action on Wall Street in mid-September. At the time I was only vaguely aware of the background: that a month before, the Canadian magazine Adbusters had put out the call to “Occupy Wall Street”, but had really just floated the idea on the internet, along with some very compelling graphics, to see if it would take hold; that a local anti-budget cut coalition top-heavy with NGOs, unions, and socialist groups had tried to take possession of the process and called for a “General Assembly” at Bowling Green. The title proved extremely misleading. When I arrived, I found the event had been effectively taken over by a veteran protest group called the Worker’s World Party, most famous for having patched together ANSWER one of the two great anti-war coalitions, back in 2003. They had already set up their banners, megaphones, and were making speeches—after which, someone explained, they were planning on leading the 80-odd assembled people in a march past the Stock Exchange itself.
    Adbusters did not initiate a meeting.

  10. #270
    Sage
    Mycroft's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:37 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    25,833

    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    Bull****. If you read the first article I posted, you'll see, first, that the very first thing that happened after Adbusters initiated a meeting with another organization is that there was friction between the two. You'd also notice that the leadership of the general assembly in New York has basically no ties to Adbusters. You're engaged in a very sad attempt at wishful thinking right now.
    Problems with reading comprehension on your part, I see.

    "Encouraged by the quick online response, White connected with New Yorkers Against Budget Cuts, which had previously organized an occupation-style action, called Bloombergville, and was already planning an August 2nd rally at the “Charging Bull” to protest cuts that would likely result from the federal debt crisis. They agreed to join forces, and N.Y.A.B.C. said that it would devote part of its upcoming rally to planning for the September 17th occupation.

    This resulted in some confusion on August 2nd, when scores of graduate students and labor activists showed up, expecting a rally for New Yorkers Against Budget Cuts. They erected a small stage and began giving amplified speeches, which alienated the roughly fifty Adbusters supporters, mostly anarchists, who came expecting a planning session. There was some angry shouting before a group of anarchists broke off, sat down in a circle on the cobblestones, and held their own meeting.

    The anarchists immediately agreed to use “horizontal” organizing methods, according to which meetings are known as general assemblies and participants make decisions by consensus and give continuous feedback through hand gestures. Moving one’s fingers in an undulating motion, palm out, pointing up, means approval of what’s being said. Palm in, pointing down, means disapproval. Crossed arms signals a “block,” a serious objection that must be heard. Some participants knew this style of meeting from left-wing traditions stretching back to the civil-rights movement and earlier."

    The friction was the result of differences in expectations...a communications breakdown, if you will. The Adbusters supporters...the anarchists...held their planning meeting and came up with the "general assembly" concept and procedures. So, the ties are there for you to read about.

    Furthermore, in the early part of the article, we get this:

    "Lasn and White quickly hammered out a post-Zuccotti plan. White would draft a new memorandum, suggesting that Phase I—signs, meetings, camps, marches—was now over. Phase II would involve a swarming strategy of “surprise attacks against business as usual,” with the potential to be “more intense and visceral, depending on how the Bloombergs of the world react.” White could hear the excitement in Lasn’s voice. Even as Lasn vented about the morning’s counterrevolution, he was doing what he could not to splash."

    Shortly after, this appears on the Adbuster's blog: After the Encampments | Adbusters Culturejammer Headquarters


    btw, you article even confirms that Lasn is an anti-capitalist.

    Your article does more to bolster my contention than it does for yours.
    TANSTAAFL

    “An armed society is a polite society.”
    ― Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon

Page 27 of 54 FirstFirst ... 17252627282937 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •