View Poll Results: Is the OWS Movement against Capitalism?

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  • Yes

    50 52.08%
  • No

    41 42.71%
  • I don't know

    5 5.21%
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Thread: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

  1. #251
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Yes, the workers built the factories.
    Yes some people working built the factory. And they were paid for their time.

    Today I helped my neighbor put a roof over her woodpile. According to your logic do I now own the wood shed?

  2. #252
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Who cares? ANd what does it have to do with me?
    Why are you pretending that you forgot what you said?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    WHy is it that millions of Americans can and do work for a better life yet the occupiers cant seem to figure out how to do it themselves?
    OWSers are more likely to have a job that teabaggers while the teabaggers are more likely to be dependent on govt assistance
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  3. #253
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
    If I was interested, I would have written more.

    And now, I have responded to your question. It is the same as for the bottom 1%. Both groups have 0% because neither work in construction.

    I have held my end of the bargain, but you are never going to hold your end of the bargain.
    Sorry, but your asking another question is not an answer to my question

    What portion of the 1% died while working construction?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  4. #254
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Yes some people working built the factory. And they were paid for their time.
    Were the workers who died paid for dying?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  5. #255
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Sorry, but your asking another question is not an answer to my question

    What portion of the 1% died while working construction?
    I wrote the answer to your question in the post above. Look at paragraph 2.

    I knew you couldn't be trusted.

  6. #256
    Student nathanj63's Avatar
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    No you are the assuming, I did not imply any such thing. I was throwing out the juxtapose to this. I am pointed out that people do work hard in America and move forward, that it is not impossible.
    You are right, i misread your original post. I think you are the person that said "current economic conditions, combined with three decades of stagnant wages for pretty much the entire country have made that impossible." is speaking in hyperbole, and you are right to say that it is possible. But the question I guess is to what extent does working hard and playing by the rules translate into upward movement. In today's economy, I think nothing is promised, regardless of how hard you work. And I think the OWS people see banks who exploited the system to their own advantage, who are largely culpable for the crisis we are in, continuing to profit, continuing to give themselves huge bonuses, continuing to live freely - not being persecuted for their crimes, while many people who did play by the rules are losing their jobs due to forces that are outside of their control. And so they are expressing their frustration.

  7. #257
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
    I wrote the answer to your question in the post above. Look at paragraph 2.

    I knew you couldn't be trusted.
    Still waiting for you answer
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  8. #258
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Still waiting for you answer
    Really, so I didn't write this
    Quote Originally Posted by Camlon View Post
    It is the same as for the bottom 1%. Both groups have 0% because neither work in construction.

  9. #259
    Student nathanj63's Avatar
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by Chaz View Post
    I actually watched a documentary today with a reporter who joined the OWS movement in an attempt to udnerstand their goals. I have to say I was surprised to see the OWS through the eyes of someone uncensored by the major media news channels. I used to think of them as jobless hippies but in truth there are some major political concerns that the OWs brings up that I find myself agreeing with.

    No the OWS movement is not against capitalism they actually support the idea in general however when it comes to matters of say in political matters they do not believe that politicans should be bought out before they ever even get into office. And I have to say I agree with them in this respect. Our political system here in america is too heavily reliant on the money flow, people who are owners of big buisnesses have the biggest political say and for the most part almost all politicians are worried about one thing, getting re-elected.

    In order to get re-elected they need to follow the guidelines of the two biggest contributers to their campaign funds
    1: Big buisness/lobbyist
    2: their political party affiliation.

    With both of these matters in mind a politicians ability to vote on an issue in true regard to their own opinion is limited in a most severe matter. If they do not represent those who helped them get into office, the chances are they will never get re-elected as they will not have the cash pool to pull from. Because of this politicians have the tendency to play it safe in most regards and only follow the will of their political party on any given issue. This is why the supercommittee we had recently failed. Two sides that will argue on any given issue no matter what with no form of compromise. No side ever wants to be the one to break party rules.

    Back on the topic of the OWS movement I have actually seen a few people with signs saying 'up with capitalism down with greed' while I could not tell you the exact meaning of this sign I suppose we can infer that it has to with the ideas of those who put in a large amount of effort will get greaer rewards than those who put in less effort and the idea that anyone in America could start a buisness if they wanted and it would be up to them to make it successful. In our corrent society those huge companies who buy out politicians have a LARGE amount of control, so much that those smaller stores really just can't compete in the market. Somehting else I can infer is that this is of course referring to massive government bailouts on corporation of which they have had a lot of stock or credit with. As I stated before that is only what I can infer from this.

    I encourage all of you to keep in mind what I said before however that the OWS main goal is to fight against political corruption in our government caused by the money flow and in the sense I support them.
    Thank you. This is in my opinion the main focus of the OWS movement as well. I think there are plenty of other ideas floating around, which there should be. And some of these ideas are well-intentioned, but in my opinion not well thought out, or at least not appropriate in the time we are living right now. Unfortunately, people seize upon the ideas that they disagree with and assume that is what the movement is all about. Is the documentary online?

  10. #260
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    So we have different opinions on the matter. If OWS was more transparent perhaps I would have a different opinion.
    OWS is incredibly transparent. Find your local branch and go have a conversation with some of them. They'll be happy to discuss their beliefs, and yours as well.


    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Adbusters created a premise for OWS, which is anti-Capitalism. 3 seconds at adbusters site should be telling enough on that subject.
    Once again, I'm not disputing either that Adbusters is anti-capitalism, or that they created the seed for OWS. What I am disputing is the degree to which Adbusters currently plays a role in OWS. The simple fact is that they are, at most, one of many different groups within OWS. There have been several articles that will confirm this. I cited a couple of them a page or two back.




    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    How can you be so sure about OWS when they represent themselves as not an organization but cells of individuals working for their own beliefs and by their own methods? Are you saying that OWS is unified in their goals as a whole? An who exactly are "they"?
    To be clear: I'm not suggesting that there aren't elements within OWS that are anti-capitalism. There are left-anarchist elements and socialists involved in the movement. What I am suggesting is that of the many, many strands of thought that are present within OWS, the anti-capitalist elements are a minority, and to the extent that one could reasonably create an aggregate throughline of their beliefs ("their" in this case referring to the entire movement), you would find that they are not, on the whole, opposed to capitalism. They're frustrated by the current crony-capitalism endemic to our nation and the corrupt political entrenchment that perpetuates such a thing.
    Last edited by Aderleth; 12-13-11 at 06:10 PM.

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