View Poll Results: Is the OWS Movement against Capitalism?

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    50 52.08%
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    41 42.71%
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Thread: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

  1. #111
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Anarcho-syndicalism is still against government.



    So anarcho-syndicalists and anarcho-capitalists are still against government institutions, for a variety of reasons. Where they differ, however, is how economic institutions should be organized.
    Right. My point was, however, that anarcho-syndicalism is considered left anarchism, not right-wing. Which is to say, once again, that "less/no government" doesn't always equal "more right-wing." So FFA is right when he says "it depends on what kind of anarchism."
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 12-12-11 at 12:14 AM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  2. #112
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Right. My point was, however, that anarcho-syndicalism is considered left anarchism, not right-wing. Which is to say, once again, that "less/no government" doesn't always equal "more right-wing." So FFA is right when he says "it depends on what kind of anarchism."
    Or the left-wing/right-wing dichotomy is such an inaccurate means of judging political philosophies and movements that we should shoot it point blank with a shotgun and bury it.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

  3. #113
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Or the left-wing/right-wing dichotomy is such an inaccurate means of judging political philosophies and movements that we should shoot it point blank with a shotgun and bury it.
    Well, the terms are pretty subjective, that's for sure. Nevertheless the general consensus is that there are different strains of anarchism and that anarchism as a whole is not exclusive to the left or the right.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  4. #114
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Well, the problems that I see are not the same as what OWS protests against. I guess the difference is, I don't resent someone else's financial success and I don't feel entitled to part of it.
    Some of the OWS protestors agree with you about that



    Does this mean you're an anti-capitalist?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  5. #115
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    What's also not particularly useful is a complete lack of recognition or concern that OWS just might be, at least in part, responsible for how they're perceived.
    What's also not particularly useful is a complete lack of recognition or concern that you just might be, at least in part, responsible for how you perceive OWS
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  6. #116
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    I should say this. OWS is generally perceived as being a leftist movement, and I believe that it is in large part. However, you'll also have a smattering of Ron Paul "end the Fed" guys here and there. This is where OWS and the more libertarian Tea Party types overlap. They are both extremely populist, and it's not corporations vs. government, it's both.

    Admittedly though I know many left libertarians and left anarchists who support Paul, so maybe that's not the BEST indication that there are non-leftists within the ranks, but who knows. I know for a fact that I'm too lazy to even get up and join those folks protesting.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  7. #117
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Those are the type of thing that make up an platform. Are political parties not unified because they have multiple ideals that they promote?

    BTW correction the protesters are not the 99% they are only a portion of the 99%. More specifically the protesters are from the Left. Prove me wrong but there is no one on the Right that supports the occupy movement.
    OWS includes many rightwing Ron Paul supporters
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  8. #118
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    Ok you keep saying that OWS is made up of different groups. please show me who they are. Give me some links.


    The entire OWS model is Leftist all the way down to the General Assembly. Every sign being held, every position being asserted. I challenge you to show me a legit OWS protester that is not on the Left.
    Challenge made...Challenge met


    Politics
    According to a Pew Research Center/Washington Post. Oct. 20-23, 19% of republicans asked said they agree with OWS
    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    I don't have any issue with any investigation.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #119
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    Well, the very term "anarchism" comes from the Greek words for "without leaders" which equate to "without government."

    And leftist philosophies have always been accused by conservatives for using big government policies.

    So I don't see how it's possible to lump those who are against all forms of government into a political wing that favors large government powers.
    I think that you need to do some research on type of Anarchism. When you watch vids of the protesters you will notice some people with things like mohawks colored hair tats etc. These people are what is known as Anarcho-Punks. Many Anarcho punks are Anarcho Communists. True Communism is the opposite of Anarchy at least if we were talking about purest Anarchy and we are not. Here is their symbol:


  10. #120
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    Re: Is the OWS against Capitalism?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Challenge made...Challenge met


    Politics
    According to a Pew Research Center/Washington Post. Oct. 20-23, 19% of republicans asked said they agree with OWS
    Does co-opting an movement count as supporting it?

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