View Poll Results: Which is more important?

Voters
53. You may not vote on this poll
  • Freedom

    44 83.02%
  • Financial Security

    9 16.98%
Page 10 of 13 FirstFirst ... 89101112 ... LastLast
Results 91 to 100 of 130

Thread: Which is more important?

  1. #91
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Lack of money - Change it by earning more money
    Oppressive government - Change it by overthrowing your government
    In no way shape or form can you compare the two as they are equal, but good try.

    In both cases the potential exists for you to overcome your obstacle in the future. But in neither case are you able to pursue your goals NOW.
    Bull****. The one you need to overthrow your government and probably die in the process, the other you just need a plan and some luck.

    Nope, there isn't freedom in either case.
    Nope, there is freedom when you are poor. You are confused. Wow, these kind of arguments are fun.


    [News flash: I'm smarter than you are. The fact that you can't dispute my points is no reason to get an attitude.
    Is that all you got? Seems weak if you ask me.

  2. #92
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Today @ 08:07 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,109

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Why does it matter if the reason you can't do what you want because of an oppressive government or a lack of money?
    two reasons:

    1. this is debate politics.
    2. it is much easier and can be left almost completely up to the individual to attain the second. not so the former. "go get a job" is a qualitatively different statement than "overthrow your government", and to pretend the two are comparable is ludicrous.

    when you have freedom, you can secure for yourself wealth with which to exercise it. when you lack freedom (as the nKorea example demonstrates), you cannot secure for yourself those things, but are dependent upon your tyrant.

  3. #93
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    In no way shape or form can you compare the two as they are equal, but good try.
    But, of course, you can't articulate WHY they aren't equal.

    Bull****. The one you need to overthrow your government and probably die in the process, the other you just need a plan and some luck.
    Obviously there are plenty of people who think it's easier to overthrow their government than to earn more money. Look at Egypt, where one of the primary causes of the revolution was the widespread poverty, cronyism and corruption in the government, and general lack of social mobility.

    Nope, there is freedom when you are poor. You are confused. Wow, these kind of arguments are fun.
    Nah, it's not really fun when you just keep repeating the same talking points instead of actually explaining WHY you think that or offering any explanation whatsoever.

    Is that all you got? Seems weak if you ask me.

    Ya I think I'm done responding to you unless you have something profound to add to the discussion.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  4. #94
    Sage
    whysoserious's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Last Seen
    12-29-16 @ 03:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    8,170

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    the other you just need a plan and some luck.
    Now you get to frame the argument? A plan and some luck? Now it comes back to Henrin's usual point: poor people are poor because they deserve it.

    Obviously you missed the major point of lacking the ability to be financially secure. If you are not able to be financially secure, then a "plan and some luck" won't do ****.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

  5. #95
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    it is much easier and can be left almost completely up to the individual to attain the second. not so the former. "go get a job" is a qualitatively different statement than "overthrow your government", and to pretend the two are comparable is ludicrous.
    Depends on where you live and what your situation is. Many people who lack financial security have few options for bettering their economic situation.

    when you have freedom, you can secure for yourself wealth with which to exercise it. when you lack freedom (as the nKorea example demonstrates), you cannot secure for yourself those things, but are dependent upon your tyrant.
    Being "free" to secure more wealth for yourself is not as simple as a lack of government interference. A person who has no education, no skills, no money or knowledge of how to acquire education/skills, was raised by someone with no education/skills/responsibility, has no mode of transportation aside from their feet, has no successful role models or acquaintances, and no knowledge whatsoever in financial literacy is not going to be able to better themselves. Yes, of course there are rare exceptions of people escaping poverty in those circumstances, but they are the exceptions to the rule. They don't have much freedom, irrespective of how much the government is responsible for those circumstances.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 12-03-11 at 11:19 PM.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  6. #96
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    But, of course, you can't articulate WHY they aren't equal.
    Care to explain how things that are clearly different can be the same? I can't even begin to imagine it so if you are smarter than me so you should be able to explain the unexplainable.

    Obviously there are plenty of people who think it's easier to overthrow their government than to earn more money. Look at Egypt, where one of the primary causes of the revolution was the widespread poverty, cronyism and corruption in the government, and general lack of social mobility.
    All of is caused by........


    Nah, it's not really fun when you just keep repeating the same talking points instead of actually explaining WHY you think that or offering any explanation whatsoever.
    Oh really? I keep repeating myself? Hmm..


    Ya I think I'm done responding to you unless you have something profound to add to the discussion.
    IF you are indeed smarter like you say, its shouldn't be any trouble to prove it. That is, if its not just unfounded confidence and intermediation.
    Last edited by Henrin; 12-03-11 at 11:24 PM.

  7. #97
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Care to explain how things that are clearly different can be the same? I can't even begin to imagine it so if you are smarter than me so you should be able to explain the unexplainable.



    All of is caused by........




    Oh really? I keep repeating myself? Hmm..



    IF you are indeed smarter like you say, its shouldn't be any trouble to prove it. That is, if its not just unfounded confidence and intermediation.
    Henrin is now on my ignore list.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  8. #98
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Last Seen
    07-19-17 @ 03:51 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    60,458

    Re: Which is more important?

    Have a wonderful rage quit.

  9. #99
    Sage
    whysoserious's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Charlotte, NC
    Last Seen
    12-29-16 @ 03:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    8,170

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Have a wonderful rage quit.
    Really? Henrin the other night:

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/aborti...post1059995115
    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Argh..I'm starting to hate how liberals support their views. Its like a child just saying I win in a high pitched squeal. All you did was say nothing like everyone else tonight. I'm going to take a break from DP. You guys aren't worth jack ****.

    You didn't defend Licenses.
    You didn't defend the presence of having to have license to to work your own body.
    You didn't do ****.

    God damn. I have said that to five people tonight and none of them even bothered to fix the problems of their lack of an argument. Worthless..
    Talk about a rage quit. Nice break, it lasted all of never.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

  10. #100
    Dungeon Master
    Hooter Babe

    DiAnna's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Northern California
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    32,613
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Which is more important?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    even Milton Friedman argued (and the vast majority of conservatives agree) that there are two groups that shouldn't be tossed into the "animating contest of freedom": children, and the truly disabled.

    but, given that we live in a knowledge economy, and that you appear pretty knowledgeable on here, i find it difficult to believe you would find yourself utterly without prospects.
    I am not without prospects. I am without lungs. When I did have functioning lungs, I worked my ass off for decades, putting everything I legally could into Deferred Compensation, IRAs, 401ks and SEPs. If I hadn't done that, I wouldn't have financial security for the immediate future, and all the freedom in the world can't allow me to function normally. So yes, financial security is more important to me now than some undefined "freedom" on which this meandering thread is based!

Page 10 of 13 FirstFirst ... 89101112 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •