View Poll Results: Am I being politically correct in the example given?

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  • Yes, that is PC

    20 46.51%
  • No, that is not PC

    14 32.56%
  • Maybe, there is not enough information

    8 18.60%
  • I have no idea

    1 2.33%
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Thread: Politically Correct?

  1. #271
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    True you did say "feel" but our responses also included feel as well.

    Where you really went wrong, though, was in the following statement:



    Again you use the qualifier about feeling, but you were making the blanket statement that everyone has felt forced to conform. It was in my response to that statement that I first made it a point to clarify the difference between feeling forced and feeling pressured, which are in that context very different things.

    You'll also note that in this discussion I never said that people don't feel as though they are forced to conform. Instead, I pointed out the false nature of said feeling due to the fact that conformity is always done by choice.

    I did say that I have never had that feeling.
    I ask it in an "either/or" question not as a covering statement of fact. The question was in say other words "Do you ever think if you don't do what others in society want even if you disagree, then you won't be able to hang out with them"? Would you agree that question essentially asks the same question as "How many of you really hate PC but feel forced to conform or be an outcast"? And then the replies were "I've never felt forced to do anything". I got to tell you my old man made me feel "forced", actually so did my boss and the Hartley brothers who beat the snot out of me. And then the little lady as you pointed out has that method of asking questions or saying "I was just mentioning it." Yah, that one makes my skin crawl because I can't out argue her and inevitably will be giving in. Only after I've whined and griped about it for awhile.

    I am going to say everyone feels forced by law to conform to a certain degree. You can of course choose to break the law but if caught they will apply some force on you.
    Last edited by grip; 12-18-11 at 11:08 PM.

  2. #272
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    The reason why the difference between "force" and pressure is important relates to the victim-mentality that has infested America these days. Language choices of this nature are important.

    To explain by way of example: My wife likes to ask me to do things by saying "Do you want to..." Invariably, when those are the words uttered, it is something I would not want to do in a million years. But by phrasing the question this way she can avoid making it a request, and instead pretend that in some perverted view of reality, she is doing me afavor by asking me to do **** that I don't want to do.

    People do this all the time. If someone asks you if you want to do something, it's almost always some **** they want you to do and they know you won't want to do. They are asking for a favor from you, but doing so in a way that turns it around as though they are doing you a favor.

    Word choice does affect our psychological perspective on things. When we use a word like forced when we really mean pressured, it gives the illusion of helplessness to the situation. That illusion then fosters the victim mentality. It's a subliminal effect, but the research indicates it is a strong effect.


    So what you consider a pointless nitpicking of terminology is actually something I consider a very important part in dispelling the illusion of helplessness that exists.
    Uh Huh... blah, blah, blah.

    Let me make this perfectly clear, the rules are "I win you Lose"!

    Hahahaha.... Ur being a dirty rotten, mudder tucker... lol

    Ok I'm resorting to my comedy routine because this one is good, you got me.

    Word choice does affect our psychological perspective on things.
    This is what I was actually eluding to as my argument but even though social pressure can build to a mental/emotional level of force it's still actually a clear choice. We are to a certain degree creatures of free will, which separates us somewhat from acting on strictly an instinctual animal level.
    Last edited by grip; 12-18-11 at 11:12 PM.

  3. #273
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Magic and Worthy were "fakers"?
    No I couldn't think of a better rhyme. Bakers, takers, Quakers?

  4. #274
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    I ask it in an "either/or" question not as a covering statement of fact. The question was in say other words "Do you ever think if you don't do what others in society want even if you disagree, then you won't be able to hang out with them"? Would you agree that question essentially asks the same question as "How many of you really hate PC but feel forced to conform or be an outcast"? And then the replies were "I've never felt forced to do anything". I got to tell you my old man made me feel "forced", actually so did my boss and the Hartley brothers who beat the snot out of me. And then the little lady as you pointed out has that method of asking questions or saying "I was just mentioning it." Yah, that one makes my skin crawl because I can't out argue her and inevitably will be giving in. Only after I've whined and griped about it for awhile.
    There's a difference between feeling forced to conform and feeling forced to do something. I wouldn't say that I've never felt as though I've been forced to do something. Just that I've never felt forced to conform.

    I am going to say everyone feels forced by law to conform to a certain degree. You can of course choose to break the law but if caught they will apply some force on you.
    I actually don't feel forced by law to conform on certain things because of the reasoning I outlined earlier. More than a few times I've broken laws because I chose to break them. When I do this, though, I willingly accept any potential consequences from my violation of law. That's willingness to accept the consequences is what prevents the feeling of being forced.

  5. #275
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    Yep, that's how that one works too. It has a bit to do with how our eyes compensate for micro-movements of the eye, too.


    And I've seen a few good one's that do that same type of trick.

    Watch this one for a little while as it alternates between a negative and black and white. Eventually you start seeing colors (I bet the effect is even better for people with normal color vision.)

    What does is it mean if you see colors right away?
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  6. #276
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    What does is it mean if you see colors right away?
    I'm not sure. I guess that would mean that your eyes create a faster "rebound" effect. Although I should have said "start seeing colors during the black and white parts" instead of just "start seeing colors".
    Last edited by Tucker Case; 12-19-11 at 10:09 AM.

  7. #277
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    There's a difference between feeling forced to conform and feeling forced to do something. I wouldn't say that I've never felt as though I've been forced to do something. Just that I've never felt forced to conform.
    Ewww,, you're tricky. To conform is literally to "behave according to socially acceptable conventions or standards." The key word behave means "act or conduct oneself in a specified way".
    So "to do" something is an act of "behaving" ergo to conform. Therefore "forced to do something" is the same as "forced to conform" disqualifying the above statement. Why do I feel like this is law school 101?

    I actually don't feel forced by law to conform on certain things because of the reasoning I outlined earlier. More than a few times I've broken laws because I chose to break them. When I do this, though, I willingly accept any potential consequences from my violation of law. That's willingness to accept the consequences is what prevents the feeling of being forced.
    You accept the consequences not out of agreement or you wouldn't have done the act, you accept them because society is forcing them on you. Though I drive real slow in certain areas because I choose to it's not out of agreement but because I feel forced to conform or face the consequences. The consequences being an act of force upon our decision making process.

  8. #278
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    What does is it mean if you see colors right away?
    I don't know about you but I think my reason is from dropping too much acid. That picture totally freaks me out

  9. #279
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by grip View Post
    Ewww,, you're tricky. To conform is literally to "behave according to socially acceptable conventions or standards." The key word behave means "act or conduct oneself in a specified way".
    So "to do" something is an act of "behaving" ergo to conform. Therefore "forced to do something" is the same as "forced to conform" disqualifying the above statement. Why do I feel like this is law school 101?
    The problem is that you are implying that "conducting one's self in a specified way" is the same as "behaving according to socially acceptable conventions".

    "Something" is not always a socially acceptable convention. for example, if I force someone to eat a pile of **** by beating them until they eat it, they are not being forced to conform, they are simply beign forced to eat ****.


    You accept the consequences not out of agreement or you wouldn't have done the act, you accept them because society is forcing them on you.
    Not at all. Society has determined that there will be certain specific consequences for certain actions, but it does not force them upon me. I agree to accept them by way of engaging in those actions.

    Though I drive real slow in certain areas because I choose to it's not out of agreement but because I feel forced realize that my choices are to conform or face the consequences and I would rather not face the consequences.
    I altered your quote so that it would be more accurate. You understand the fact that society has created those consequences, so you base your decisions on that knowledge.

    The consequences being an act of force upon our decision making process.
    The consequences aren't an act of force upon your decision making process, they are a factor in it. If they were an act of force, you wouldn't have the option to not conform.

  10. #280
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    Re: Politically Correct?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    The problem is that you are implying that "conducting one's self in a specified way" is the same as "behaving according to socially acceptable conventions".

    "Something" is not always a socially acceptable convention. for example, if I force someone to eat a pile of **** by beating them until they eat it, they are not being forced to conform, they are simply beign forced to eat ****.

    Not at all. Society has determined that there will be certain specific consequences for certain actions, but it does not force them upon me. I agree to accept them by way of engaging in those actions.

    I altered your quote so that it would be more accurate. You understand the fact that society has created those consequences, so you base your decisions on that knowledge.

    The consequences aren't an act of force upon your decision making process, they are a factor in it. If they were an act of force, you wouldn't have the option to not conform.
    We keep batting the "feel forced" which equates to social pressure to "being physically forced" or "forced consequences" by a greater force, which is not really the measure.

    Before this digresses into po-tate-toe vs po-ta-tow goony babble let's ask the question as a Poll. And you can't voice your opinion on it's meaning and all that claptrap and no influencing anyones decision with your seniority or popularity. That would be considered social pressure. And we can't refer back to this thread. Let the posters argue the question first then after a winner is decided we can chime in.

    "How many of you really hate Political Correctness but feel forced to conform or be an outcast"? This is the original question slightly modified.

    If the Yes's hit 20 first then I win and you two nudniks, tpd and TC have to lick the chili off my toilet rim and be my manslaves for two months.
    Seriously, you have to say on that thread "grip took us to school because we are a fool". And if vice versa on the No's then I'll say you won,, agreeable? If the poll never hits 20 yea's or nays then 10 was the limit. Just so a majority is reached within a 7 day time limit.

    Since you not only disagree with the question you even disagree with the context of it. I mean if you're really that confident then those terms should be acceptable? You'll probably win not because I think what've I said is that far out of bounds in accepted public speech, but because the members here have a strange habit of dissecting someones summary opinions into unconnected statements to reply and argue. I think if a whole opinion is given then it should be countered by a similar method. Not chopped up and pulled out of context.

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