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Insurrection

What would it take? (Refer to OP)

  • Nothing, I will always be loyal to the government

    Votes: 1 3.8%

  • A major infringement of the constitution

    Votes: 13 50.0%

  • Abdication of power to foreign or domestic institutions (eg. corporations)

    Votes: 15 57.7%

  • A provably fraudulent election with no re-vote

    Votes: 13 50.0%

  • Poor economic choices that continue to bankrupt the country

    Votes: 4 15.4%

  • A persistently deadlocked congress / selfish representatives

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Martial law or military jurisdiction without proper cause

    Votes: 23 88.5%

  • Infringement of my personal property

    Votes: 7 26.9%

  • My friends, family, or community being subjected to government tyranny

    Votes: 13 50.0%

  • Other (please explain)

    Votes: 4 15.4%
  • Total voters
    26
Temporal

Temporal

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Given all the talk of power shifts lately, I thought I'd bring this topic for theoretical discussion. :)

What would the government have to do for you to take up arms against it and join an open revolt?
 
It sure would take a lot for me. I think the most questionable one I marked was the provably fraudulent election. Even the ones I did check would have to be pretty extreme. I have a family and taking care of them is my one and only priority. I would have to be absolutely convinced that the best choice for them was for me to help overthrow a tyrannical government.

I don't mind OWS and Tea Party working their first amendment rights and I wouldn't mind other large movements taking similar action or finding a way to make dramatic changes, but taking up arms and possibly killing fellow Americans is just too far out there for me to imagine at this point.
 
Temporal said:
Given all the talk of power shifts lately, I thought I'd bring this topic for theoretical discussion. :)

What would the government have to do for you to take up arms against it and join an open revolt?
Click to expand...

I voted for everything except "poor economic choices" and "deadlocked congress".

The thing is I don't think we are currently anywhere near the levels necessary for an armed revolt. Such insurrections are not to be taken lightly, and there are other avenues that should be taken before that becomes a viable option.
 
Temporal said:
Given all the talk of power shifts lately, I thought I'd bring this topic for theoretical discussion. :)

What would the government have to do for you to take up arms against it and join an open revolt?
Click to expand...

I can't think of anything, honestly - I'm not the 'open revolt' type - so for me to leave my children and family - ****. Nothing could make me leave them to deal with something else.
 
Aunt Spiker said:
I can't think of anything, honestly - I'm not the 'open revolt' type - so for me to leave my children and family - ****. Nothing could make me leave them to deal with something else.
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I apologize for not making the first choice more general then. I should have just left it at "no", instead of implying that "no" = "I will always support government".
 
The beauty of our system is that we can change it as we need. There is no need for armed insurrection. Outside of a coup, our government is our responsibility.
 
Is it just me, or is it many of the same people who feared violence from the TEA party and accused them of near treason for having guns at rallys, as well as signs that spoke about refreshing that tree of liberty, now calling for armed insurrection and revolt? :D

To answer the OP, when talking civil war it would have to be something that impacts me directly and significantly, like giving my house to armed troops or something like that. I would, on the other hand, also readily help my neighbors if marauding bands of OWS protesters came to 'claim' property they believe they're entitled to. LOL
 
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Im not the armed insurrection type...however, I have no problem arming myself if necessary...there would be a few reasons that would move me to take an action, and I made 3 choices in the poll....but I would much prefer other avenues and I dont believe we are anywhere near that point...thankfully
 
X Factor said:
Is it just me, or is it many of the same people who feared violence from the TEA party and accused them of near treason for having guns at rallys, as well as signs that spoke about refreshing that tree of liberty, now calling for armed insurrection and revolt? :D

To answer the OP, when talking civil war it would have to be something that impacts me directly and significantly, like giving my house to armed troops or something like that. I would, on the other hand, also readily help my neighbors when the marauding bands of OWS protesters came to claim property they believe they're entitled to. Lol.
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It's just you and an overactive imagination. I have not seen any one who "feared violence from the tea party"(though I suppose there might have been a couple nutjobs who did fear it), and I don't see any one against the tea party calling for insurrection. So nice try spinning this into something to cry about, but you failed pretty miserably at it.
 
Temporal said:
I apologize for not making the first choice more general then. I should have just left it at "no", instead of implying that "no" = "I will always support government".
Click to expand...

Sorry - I didn't even see the poll. :)

Seriously, though - even if I'm outraged over something I don't think it would compel me to uproot and take up arms at all.
 
It would have to be a mix of massive and ongoing violation of the Constitution, combined with a completely stuck/disfunctional/corrupted political process which destroys all hope the problem could be solved by peaceful means.

If my government massively violated basic human and civil rights, AND abolished elections that would allow me to vote them out of office in favor of an opposition that takes back these violations, that might be a reason. First option would be peaceful mass protest. If that does not work, maybe the tyrannic government even strikes it down with force, I might consider it viable to use force too.
 
Redress said:
It's just you and an overactive imagination. I have not seen any one who "feared violence from the tea party"(though I suppose there might have been a couple nutjobs who did fear it), and I don't see any one against the tea party calling for insurrection. So nice try spinning this into something to cry about, but you failed pretty miserably at it.
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Well, if you include much of the commentary from MSNCB, then yes I'll agree. Then again, I do recall a lot of hysteria from far leftisits who said the Tea Partiers were violent because they had guns.

Anyways, I'm not sure what the line should be when it comes to typically bloody insurrections.
 
X Factor said:
Is it just me, or is it many of the same people who feared violence from the TEA party and accused them of near treason for having guns at rallys, as well as signs that spoke about refreshing that tree of liberty, now calling for armed insurrection and revolt? :D
Click to expand...

I don't want to derail the thread too much about this particular sub-topic, but if the police and authorities treated the Tea Party for their protests the way the police and authorities have started to treat the Occupiers for their protests I wouldn't blame them for protecting themselves.
 
Wake said:
Well, if you include much of the commentary from MSNCB, then yes I'll agree. Then again, I do recall a lot of hysteria from far leftisits who said the Tea Partiers were violent because they had guns.

Anyways, I'm not sure what the line should be when it comes to typically bloody insurrections.
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My particular beef against the Tea Party in regards to their display of firearms is that they threatened to use them despite the legal transition of government. Which is wrong, as such violence or threat of violence automatically delegitimizes the movement.

However, if the Tea Partiers were threatened the way the Occupiers have been threatened I would totally support brandishing such firearms for their own self-protection.

There is a difference between those two things.
 
Redress said:
It's just you and an overactive imagination. I have not seen any one who "feared violence from the tea party"(though I suppose there might have been a couple nutjobs who did fear it),
Click to expand...
You don't remember all the angst about 'violent rhetoric' directed at the TEA party after the Giffords shooting? You don't remember people here accusing the TEA party of inciting violence because they used cross hairs graphics to indicate political opponents they wanted defeated in elections? There were entire threads on it.

and I don't see any one against the tea party calling for insurrection. So nice try spinning this into something to cry about, but you failed pretty miserably at it.
Click to expand...
Actually what I said was that many of the same people who accused the TEA party of being violent, now seem to think armed, open revolt is not such a bad idea. I'm not crying about it. I think it's funny more than anything.
 
Wake said:
Well, if you include much of the commentary from MSNCB, then yes I'll agree. Then again, I do recall a lot of hysteria from far leftisits who said the Tea Partiers were violent because they had guns.

Anyways, I'm not sure what the line should be when it comes to typically bloody insurrections.
Click to expand...

I think you are once again either imagining it, or you are twisting what was actually said.
 
I dont think the teaparty is any more violent than OWS...each side of the spectrum uses whatever they can as a wedge against the other...Xfactor is right about the xhair thing etc...but hes also forgetting the teaparty rhetoric coming out on here about the OWs it goes both ways :)
 
X Factor said:
You don't remember all the angst about 'violent rhetoric' directed at the TEA party after the Giffords shooting? You don't remember people here accusing the TEA party of inciting violence because they used cross hairs graphics to indicate political opponents they wanted defeated in elections? There were entire threads on it.
Click to expand...

What, both people? Seriously, there was talk about violent rhetoric, which is small scale and not aimed at the tea party, and which is not what you described at first.

Actually what I said was that many of the same people who accused the TEA party of being violent, now seem to think armed, open revolt is not such a bad idea. I'm not crying about it. I think it's funny more than anything.
Click to expand...

And you might have a point, except that those people are not calling for open revolt, except possibly an isolated nutjob, nor are they saying it is not such a bad idea. So basically you are making **** up to then point at and laugh. Well done!
 
X Factor said:
You don't remember all the angst about 'violent rhetoric' directed at the TEA party after the Giffords shooting? You don't remember people here accusing the TEA party of inciting violence because they used cross hairs graphics to indicate political opponents they wanted defeated in elections? There were entire threads on it.

Actually what I said was that many of the same people who accused the TEA party of being violent, now seem to think armed, open revolt is not such a bad idea. I'm not crying about it. I think it's funny more than anything.
Click to expand...

Can you please stop turning this thread into your personal partisan bitch fest? No one here accused the Tea Party of anything. The OP is talking about what would bring a person to revolt, not whether or not the Tea Party is sanctified.

Lord... some people just can't help themselves.
 
samsmart said:
I don't want to derail the thread too much about this particular sub-topic, but if the police and authorities treated the Tea Party for their protests the way the police and authorities have started to treat the Occupiers for their protests I wouldn't blame them for protecting themselves.
Click to expand...

If the TEA party broke the law, yes you would have blamed them. You'd have been all over them. Good grief, has it even occurred to you that the T party was treated differently because it behaved differently?
 
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I would never take up arms against the government. I would only take up arms against usurpers within the government, that wished to do the government and the country harm and replace them with people that according to the law and the Constitution.
 
Moderator's Warning:
Folks, the OP has asked that we get on topic. People, myself included, should listen and do just that. If there is a desire to have the tangential discussion, please make a separate thread.
 
---deleted :(
 
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There is nothing short of defending myself and my friends/family from getting gunned down in the streets that would cause me to take up arms against the government. To do so would be virtual suicide. But if the government were already killing citizenry, what difference would it make?
 
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