View Poll Results: Should an applicants race be a deciding factor for admission to a university?

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Thread: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

  1. #201
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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    Ah, the young girl first discovering Ayn Rand... and learning a whole new language. New meanings for old words....

    Compassion is wicked.

    Charity is brutality.

    And non-existant racial bias admissions is...dum-dum-dum... racist...

    Well, at least the first two aren't fantasies.

    I think Ayn Rand basically attracts sheltered middle class kids with little or no real life experience and only faux accomplishments.
    the last thing the nation needs in yet another randroid.
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    THAT IS NOT WHAT THUNDER SAID. Read his statement again.
    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    Segregation ended for the most part in the early 1980s.
    This is what he said. So if he meant what you are suggesting, it has never ended. If he meant what Jamesrage suggested he was just as wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Actually that is a pile of data showing the government did not force people to go places they did not really want to go. Desegregation was not meant to force people to travel, live or work where they did not want to. I mean really Hispanics, Eastern European's and Asians segregate themselves and so do blacks etc. It is not the governments job to to force it on people who don't want it. It is the governments job to enforce it when someone does want to go someplace and are barred because of race.
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    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by OhIsee.Then View Post
    I get it. Really the best way to fight racism is to do nothing based on those disadvantaged by race, better would be to do nothing based on race like using only SAT & ACT scores that we can believe have nothing to do with race, best would be to not even recognize race exists. Got it.
    I get it. You and many others here believe blacks are intellectually inferior and they need lower standards to measure success, like being accepted into a prestigious college. Once they are in a college they didn't qualify for other than having the proper colored skin, will they receive extra points to their grades for having the proper colored skin? Maybe the non-black kids will have to take more challenging tests to keep their scores down. As for Johnny, the smart white kid that was bumped from the school he wanted to attend due to the color of his skin, he should be happy with this policy since he obviously did something wrong like study hard and be born with the wrong DNA.

    And this is how liberalism is going to fix the education system that is run by liberals, and in most major cities.....black school boards, black school administrations. Google Atlanta School Board and tell me who is to blame for our miserable public inner city schools. It sure as hell isn't Johnny or his parents. Brilliant.
    I love the smell of burning moonbat in the morning.

  4. #204
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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    It's not though. I find this link interesting
    SAT scores show disparities by race, gender, family income - USATODAY.com
    Some tidbits from it (SAT scores by demographics)
    1702: Average for students reporting family incomes of more than $200,000 a year
    1506: Average for students reporting family incomes of $60,000-$80,000 a year



    1623: Average for Asian students
    1581: Average for white students
    1448: Average for American Indian or Alaskan native students
    1364: Average for Latino students


    The fact is, if you have the resources (good private schools, tutors, parents with college educations to help you in doing your homework) it's much easier to do well.
    Okay, but two points:

    1. Since the racial disadvantage is just an economic disadvantage anyway, why not simply base an AA policy on income instead of race?

    2. At some point, you have to have standards. Should we just let anyone into college simply because they might have had a disadvantage?

    Also, I do see a real disconnect between what college admission means to different groups. To whites who tend to have good SAT scores, etc., college is like a reward-you did well, now you get into a good college. I hear many blacks talk about college like its an opportunity, not the end game. For them, admission is a chance to show they can succeed. That can lead to very different ideas about affirmative action.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    the last thing the nation needs in yet another randroid.

    Unlike Sartre (No Exit) and Camus (the Stranger), Rand's world view can only be stomached in fictional form.

    Colbert brilliantly sums up the shortcomings of Rand revival:

    The Word - Rand Illusion - The Colbert Report - 2009-11-03 - Video Clip | Comedy Central

    Do the people who read Atlas Shrugged actually follow the plot? Big industrialists lobby the government to get an unfair advantage. Then there's the idealized fictional company that is run out of business by the others. You know, the guy who was so smart he got beat by the lesser companies. (maybe he should have read Atlas Shrugged and realized that you get an competitive advantage by lobbying)

    But somehow people talk about the book as a condemnation of safety net programs. It's about corporate ineptitude, corruption, and special interests lobbying Washington. It's about greedy companies manipulating the laws in their favor--thus putting the brilliant people out of business or driving them to quit. I think people are told a false summary of what the book is about before reading it, then as they turn the pages, ignore the text and just superimpose their own version.


    I liked the Fountainhead. The main character in that book would have never 'gone Gault'--he perseveres through all of it and triumphs through his own brilliance and vision. But Atlas Shrugged is a train wreck of misguided and impractical ideas only working in a fictional fantasy world.

  6. #206
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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    THAT IS NOT WHAT THUNDER SAID. Read his statement again.



    Shifts in 80's Failed to Ease Segregation - New York Times



    White flight - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia



    School Segregation in the 1980's: Trends in the United States and Metropolitan Areas. A Report by the National School Desegregation Project.



    The pile of data showing that segregation didn't really end with the 1950s or an executive order(remember, that is your original claim) is extensive.
    Self imposed segregation and not busing kids from other school districts is not state sponsored racial segregation nor is it even official segregation.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    I feel that until we make race a non factor that racism will persist. Why should any application (or person for that matter) need to know race unless race is somehow at least in part a deciding factor.

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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    It's not though. I find this link interesting
    SAT scores show disparities by race, gender, family income - USATODAY.com
    Some tidbits from it (SAT scores by demographics)
    1702: Average for students reporting family incomes of more than $200,000 a year
    1506: Average for students reporting family incomes of $60,000-$80,000 a year



    1623: Average for Asian students
    1581: Average for white students
    1448: Average for American Indian or Alaskan native students
    1364: Average for Latino students


    The fact is, if you have the resources (good private schools, tutors, parents with college educations to help you in doing your homework) it's much easier to do well.
    Great post!

    Yes, all the self-made rich kids and their SAT prep classes, tutors, and summer camps in the Bahamas working 1/2 day to get some 'community service' to put on their college application.

    "Look, I saved a turtle. It's not fair if you take a black kid who worked a part-time job, took care of his grandma, and volunteered for his church over me. It's RACIST, I tell you. My parents spent a fortune trying to give me every advantage, now I have to go to my 2nd choice school. Boo-hoo. Boo-hoo."

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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by Baralis View Post
    I feel that until we make race a non factor that racism will persist. Why should any application (or person for that matter) need to know race unless race is somehow at least in part a deciding factor.
    Does a school have a right to create what they believe is an ideal academic environment?

    Answer that.

    Does a school have a right to create a student body that represents diversity, a mix of ideas and experiences?

    If you've ever been in a study group with people from different socioeconomic backgrounds--you'd understand the power of a diverse student body.

    If you think the financial aide student with lower SAT scores has nothing to teach YOU... If you think he didn't work his ass off and overcome tremendous obstacles to get there. Then you are the racist. Not the administrators that painstakingly picked out the right mix of students to BETTER their University.

    Strange that the lilly white Randroids never complain about the football and basketball scholarships. Imagine the Michigan State O-line with only high SAT scores...

  10. #210
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    Re: 21st Century Racism Is Thriving In American Academe

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    Does a school have a right to create a student body that represents diversity, a mix of ideas and experiences?
    A school's purpose is to educate and that's it, not form some pc-tard feel good diversity coalition.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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