View Poll Results: Do you think a national referendum would be good for the United States?

Voters
18. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, congress could send it to the people, and they could invalidate a bill passed by congress

    1 5.56%
  • Yes, but it should only work in a case that the congress can send a referendum to the people

    1 5.56%
  • Yes, but only the people should be able to use it to invalidate a bill passed by congress

    6 33.33%
  • No, none whatsoever. The current system is fine.

    10 55.56%
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Thread: National Referenda

  1. #11
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    Re: National Referenda

    I'm not sure how it would even work. Elections are governed by the states, and every state has different rules about how such a thing could even get on the ballot. So before anything like this could even happen, you'd have to amend the Constitution to make it possible.


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    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
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    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

  2. #12
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    Re: National Referenda

    Quote Originally Posted by irviding View Post
    What do you think of instituting a nation-wide system of national referendum? We were debating this in my government class the other day and the professor, in favor of them, brought up an argument that they would be prudent if limited to only certain circumstances. For example, if the Congress wanted to put something up for referendum, they could as a means of showing the other party the public at large disagree. A good example of this might be the current Democratic house minority putting up for referendum a bill to raise taxes on the wealthy, which 60-70% (varies poll by poll) support. They could then tell the majority, hey look at what the majority of the country thinks, and you can honestly sit here and keep fighting for only 30%? Or if say, after the healthcare law passed, the minority republicans could put up for referendum a repeal of it. They could then have shown the Democrats that they are fighting for a bill a majority of the country oppose. Or even another criteria if enough signatures are provided, and each signature is verified, the people could invalidate a bill passed by the congress. No ballot initiatives though, that is not what this poll is about. For reference that would be the people drafting their own law to go before congress. A valid counter to the bill, however, is that the people are very easily influenced by things like TV advertisements, mailings, etc, and would not be able to decide on a referendum with their own true beliefs. It is also important to note things like the healthcare law, which was thousands of pages long. The average everyday American isn't going to take the time to read through it and see if he/she agrees with it or not. To put it simple, the average American is just not smart enough to make those decisions for the greater good (say a bill that would raise taxes to pay for a war, Americans might say no no no, don't you raise my taxes, or during the financial crisis, Americans would not have known that bailing out the financial institutions was absolutely necessary to keep the economy from completely going under) and it should be left out of their hands. And please don't get on my case for saying the average American isn't smart enough. I don't want to hear random drivel about how people in congress are bumbling idiots. Those on both sides of the aisle are very well educated in 99% of the cases and are above the average American in terms of intelligence, clearly.

    Those above are just views I complied during the debate we had. I am on the fence... personally leaning towards no referenda.
    Personally, I think it is a 10th amendment right that people be allowed to influence legislation via referenda.
    Also, we need to legalize recreational drugs and prostitution.

  3. #13
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    Re: National Referenda

    I absolutely believe we should have a national referendum system. When congress gives itself a fat raise and giant perks, the people can slap them soundly about the head and shoulders whilst taking it away from them. When congress passes laws making it easier for PACs to anonymously foot the bill for congressional ads and campaign expenses, the people can veto it. When congress passes laws requiring less scrutiny on the use of funds from campaign warchests, and rolling those funds into their own pockets, the people can repeal the law and substitute one that states that any campaign contributions not used in the current campaign must be turned into the US government's general fund.

    These ****ers don't go to congress to serve us. They go to congress to help themselves to power and money. Time we took our power as a people back from these lying, thieving dickheads.

  4. #14
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    Re: National Referenda

    Quote Originally Posted by DiAnna View Post
    I absolutely believe we should have a national referendum system. When congress gives itself a fat raise and giant perks, the people can slap them soundly about the head and shoulders whilst taking it away from them. When congress passes laws making it easier for PACs to anonymously foot the bill for congressional ads and campaign expenses, the people can veto it. When congress passes laws requiring less scrutiny on the use of funds from campaign warchests, and rolling those funds into their own pockets, the people can repeal the law and substitute one that states that any campaign contributions not used in the current campaign must be turned into the US government's general fund.



    These ****ers don't go to congress to serve us. They go to congress to help themselves to power and money. Time we took our power as a people back from these lying, thieving dickheads.


    I agree, I agree, I agree...

  5. #15
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    Re: National Referenda

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I think the example of California has forever poisoned the concept of voter referenda to me. California's government is a trianwreck, largely because the voters have straitjacketed the legislature through voter referenda which sound good in soundbite form, but are disasters if one thinks about the ramifications for more than the thirty seconds they are in the voting booth. I would not want such a system replicated on the federal level.
    California is an example why there must be stipulations in place if referendums are allowed, not an example of referendums being a bad idea.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  6. #16
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    Re: National Referenda

    nah, I don't support national referenda... I support the US constitution.

    a national referendum is a radical departure from our most basic government system.

    the Constitution provides that all legislative powers reside in Congress... it provides the people a voice in legislation by way of the House of Representatives.( technically, thanks to the 17th amendment, both houses are voices of the people)


    a national referendum nullifies the legitimacy of those institutions.

    in addition, I think direct democracy is definitely more evil than what we have now... tyranny of the majority is most certainly the outcome of allowing national referenda.
    the very fastest way for this country to implode is to allow direct democracy to take hold.

  7. #17
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    Re: National Referenda

    A national referenda system isn't direct democracy. For example, there would probably be stringent rules and the difficulty of adhering to all of them would be so arduous that only matters of significance by the majority of voters could ever make the cut. One thing could be that 2/3 of a state's registered voters be required for that state to ratify a specific referendum, and probably 2/3 of the states could be required to ratify it in order to hold the referendum vote nationally.

    What we have isn't working. Congress does not function as the founding fathers envisioned. Congress is a money-based institution where laws are written based on the wishes of the highest bidder. The people have no say any more, and look what it has wrought. If there was a way for the people to legally and legitimately take back that power by controlling the most egregious abuses of congressional self-servitude, then it would be a sobering reminder of who was really supposed to be in charge of this country.
    Last edited by DiAnna; 11-27-11 at 11:23 PM.

  8. #18
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    Re: National Referenda

    Well - we're not a direct democracy, anyway . .. we're a representative democracy - like it means anything these days. More and more people disprove of this platform we're built on.
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
    Pynchon - Gravity's Rainbow

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    Re: National Referenda

    I wrote it all from my phone give me a break lol

  10. #20
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    Re: National Referenda

    yes, we should allow national referendums.

    but they should require a super-majority of 60% to pass.

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