View Poll Results: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

Voters
41. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, it would reduce corruption and ensure that congress was more focused on the American people

    14 34.15%
  • No, it would have no effect/it would change things for the worse

    21 51.22%
  • Other (please explain)

    6 14.63%
Page 12 of 15 FirstFirst ... 21011121314 ... LastLast
Results 111 to 120 of 147

Thread: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

  1. #111
    Sage
    misterman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Last Seen
    02-09-12 @ 08:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,913

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Damn straight I'm arrogant. So what?
    Because someone even more arrogant than you might come along and decide YOU shouldn't vote.

    Also because arrogant people are jerks in general.
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  2. #112
    Sage
    misterman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Last Seen
    02-09-12 @ 08:41 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,913

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    Why not? I am practically by definition more objective about other people than I am about myself.
    Sure, but so is everyone else. Why do you think you are entitled to make the rest of the world revolve around you?
    "Yes I read the 9th [amendment]. It doesn't say **** about abortion." -Jamesrage

  3. #113
    Sage
    jamesrage's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    A place where common sense exists
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:25 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    31,073

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    Scumbag A, because he has more time. But... you're comparing one scumbag A to one scumbag B, when the reality is that you would have ten scumbag Bs for every one scumbag A. And in that case, I absolutely believe that scumbag A is the better option.


    You may not have ten scumbag Bs for ever scumbag A because there is the chance that when scumbag B can't run again a decent or semi-decent politician will take his place.And even if you got ten scumbag Bs for every scumbag A they still couldn't do as much damage because each scumbag Bhas to re-learn what the previous scumbag B knew in order to exploit the system, this means they end up doing less damage.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  4. #114
    Sage
    Cephus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    CA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:25 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    29,797

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    You may not have ten scumbag Bs for ever scumbag A because there is the chance that when scumbag B can't run again a decent or semi-decent politician will take his place.And even if you got ten scumbag Bs for every scumbag A they still couldn't do as much damage because each scumbag Bhas to re-learn what the previous scumbag B knew in order to exploit the system, this means they end up doing less damage.
    Agreed. By keeping these lifetime scumbags out of office, you know that eventually, every one who leaves office is going to have to deal with the ramifications of what they caused. hopefully that will at least make them think about what they're doing. Secondly, we need to remove the reasons a lot of these idiots get into office: money and power. They won't be in office long enough to gain any real power and we shouldn't pay them all that well either. In fact, I'd be happy not to give them a paycheck at all, simply to cover their expenses during the time they are in office. Pay the mortgage on their normal house, give their families a government credit card to cover living expenses, pay for their apartment in Washington D.C., etc. Maybe give them a small cash allowance per year. When they get out, they had the same kind of life they had before they went in, but they certainly didn't get rich doing it. Politics ought to be about serving the public good, not feathering your own nest.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  5. #115
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:21 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    90,037

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    The length of term of a member of Congress is already limited by the US Constitution. We already have term limits. Two years for an elected House member and six years for a US senator. Then their term ends.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  6. #116
    Professor

    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    MI and AZ
    Last Seen
    03-15-15 @ 01:29 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    1,581

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Agreed. By keeping these lifetime scumbags out of office, you know that eventually, every one who leaves office is going to have to deal with the ramifications of what they caused. hopefully that will at least make them think about what they're doing. Secondly, we need to remove the reasons a lot of these idiots get into office: money and power. They won't be in office long enough to gain any real power and we shouldn't pay them all that well either. In fact, I'd be happy not to give them a paycheck at all, simply to cover their expenses during the time they are in office. Pay the mortgage on their normal house, give their families a government credit card to cover living expenses, pay for their apartment in Washington D.C., etc. Maybe give them a small cash allowance per year. When they get out, they had the same kind of life they had before they went in, but they certainly didn't get rich doing it. Politics ought to be about serving the public good, not feathering your own nest.
    Let me argue with your position here by comparing it to a 'normal' work environment from my experience as a high level engineer/architect in the computer industry. The similarity of the computer industry and what our politicians are up against is in complexity and rate of change that result in the necessity to change and the change has to be supported by changing the operational rules, similar to laws. The similarity goes even further with marketing and sales behaving like lobbyists. If we have the manufacturing engineers, purchasing staff, assembly staff, security staff etc. sharing equally in setting our direction with the highest level technologists and business managers failures would follow quickly. So, I'm sure you can see where this is going. Therefore, I want to be able to elect people with intellect and ability to solve new problems with new rules that are occurring because the old rules are not working. These people often have been successful earning money legitimately, a net worth of 100k to 500k, investments, a vacation home, etc. I don't want them to have to give this up to if they change careers to politician. So, again, who do you want solving our problems?

  7. #117
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    I was being facetious in my post. Anyway, of course there would be loopholes. There will always be loopholes in literally any legislation. There would be loopholes with term limits. Big enough to drive a truck through, as you state. There is no such thing as perfect legislation.
    I disagree. A constitutional amendment specifying term limits would be fairly straightforward, just as it is for the presidency. For example:

    1. No person shall be elected to the United States House of Representative more than three times, and no person who has held the office of Representative for more than one year of a term to which some other person was elected Representative shall be elected to the office of Representative more than twice.

    2. No person shall be elected to the United States Senate more than twice, and no person who has held the office of Senator for more than three years of a term to which some other person was elected Senator shall be elected to the office of Senator more than once.


    Pretty straightforward IMO. If there are any loopholes in that, they're the kind of loopholes that are easily fixable with minor wording changes. An amendment regulating campaign finance reform, on the other hand, would have lots of loopholes. As we've seen with the McCain-Feingold Act, regulating one kind of campaign spending simply gives rise to another kind, such as 527 organizations. That's fine for ordinary legislation...you simply pass a new piece of legislation to close the loopholes. But you can't really do that with a constitutional amendment. The amendment process is simply too cumbersome to amend the Constitution every time some new loophole in campaign finance law is discovered IMO.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

  8. #118
    Phonetic Mnemonic
    radcen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Look to your right... I'm that guy.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:08 AM
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    33,432

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    I disagree. A constitutional amendment specifying term limits would be fairly straightforward, just as it is for the presidency. For example:

    1. No person shall be elected to the United States House of Representative more than three times, and no person who has held the office of Representative for more than one year of a term to which some other person was elected Representative shall be elected to the office of Representative more than twice.

    2. No person shall be elected to the United States Senate more than twice, and no person who has held the office of Senator for more than three years of a term to which some other person was elected Senator shall be elected to the office of Senator more than once.


    Pretty straightforward IMO. If there are any loopholes in that, they're the kind of loopholes that are easily fixable with minor wording changes. An amendment regulating campaign finance reform, on the other hand, would have lots of loopholes. As we've seen with the McCain-Feingold Act, regulating one kind of campaign spending simply gives rise to another kind, such as 527 organizations. That's fine for ordinary legislation...you simply pass a new piece of legislation to close the loopholes. But you can't really do that with a constitutional amendment. The amendment process is simply too cumbersome to amend the Constitution every time some new loophole in campaign finance law is discovered IMO.
    You're right. We disagree. All this does is limit time of service. It does nothing to address the reasons why longer terms of service are the problem.

  9. #119
    Phonetic Mnemonic
    radcen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Look to your right... I'm that guy.
    Last Seen
    Today @ 12:08 AM
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    33,432

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Agreed. By keeping these lifetime scumbags out of office, you know that eventually, every one who leaves office is going to have to deal with the ramifications of what they caused. hopefully that will at least make them think about what they're doing. Secondly, we need to remove the reasons a lot of these idiots get into office: money and power. They won't be in office long enough to gain any real power and we shouldn't pay them all that well either. In fact, I'd be happy not to give them a paycheck at all, simply to cover their expenses during the time they are in office. Pay the mortgage on their normal house, give their families a government credit card to cover living expenses, pay for their apartment in Washington D.C., etc. Maybe give them a small cash allowance per year. When they get out, they had the same kind of life they had before they went in, but they certainly didn't get rich doing it. Politics ought to be about serving the public good, not feathering your own nest.
    Essentially, instead of attracting good people, we'd be attracting incompetent people. Any person with an ounce of drive and ability would run away from a scenario like this.

  10. #120
    Enemy Combatant
    Kandahar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Last Seen
    10-15-13 @ 08:47 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Liberal
    Posts
    20,688

    Re: Would setting term limits and wages tied to average wage help motivate congress?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    You're right. We disagree. All this does is limit time of service. It does nothing to address the reasons why longer terms of service are the problem.
    As I see it, the primary reasons that longer terms of service are problems are: 1) A given politician will be running for reelection more often than not, and therefore will need to raise campaign funds from lobbyists. 2) The longer a politician serves in Congress, the more insulated they become from their constituents and the more they adopt the culture of Congress itself...which is rarely a good thing.

    Term limits would address both of those problems. They'd reduce the likelihood of a given politician needing to raise money for his reelection war chest, and they'd increase the turnover rate so that legislators are more in tune with their constituents and have less time to develop a Congress culture of their own.
    Are you coming to bed?
    I can't. This is important.
    What?
    Someone is WRONG on the internet! -XKCD

Page 12 of 15 FirstFirst ... 21011121314 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •