View Poll Results: Did Democrats cause the super committee to fail on purpose?

Voters
71. You may not vote on this poll
  • No, they actually thought a trillion dollar tax hike in a recession was reasonable

    9 12.68%
  • No, it was a bi-partisan failure

    28 39.44%
  • Yes, the plan from the beginning was to fail

    34 47.89%
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Thread: They did it on purpose

  1. #81
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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    sure, cut only spending on defense, subsidies to the oil & natural gas industry, farm subsidies, and other corporate welfare. sounds like a good plan.
    I'm shocked, truly SHOCKED by your desire to compromise given how much you're conitnually crying for the Republicans to do it.

    Wait, no I'm not. You're the epitome of a hyper partisan, I'm not shocked at all.

    So you want Republicans to agree to a tax increase that is targetted at only one class of people and then you want to turn around and not compromise on any spending cuts on items they would like to cut.

    Well, thanks for providing a keen insight into the mentality of why the supercommittee can't work.

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    Re: They did it on purpose

    I said it again, and I'm going to say it again:
    Taxes should be lowered, but loopholes in the tax system should be closed. Tax cuts should expire for all classes. Spending should be decreased, particularly at the areas of defense and welfare, but cutting waste and unecessary and unproductive projects should be done first.
    Both parties and both ideologies need to compromise. Is that too hard to understand or implement?
    "The misery of being exploited by capitalists is nothing compared to the misery of not being exploited at all" - Joan Robinson
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    Re: They did it on purpose

    The name of this thread should be why did Grover Norquist and his handful of his teatards Block any chance of reasonable discourse and compromise because they signed a Pledge to the Super Rich that they will not vote for more taxs...which in the end they wont and cant keep....
    This thread INSINUATES this was just a democrat failure and that is pure Horsedung

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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Any member of congress that truly believes that they should not balance the budget should be sent home. We private citizens by law have to balance our checkbooks or else pay a penalty and if we continue to write "bad checks" then we go to jail. Since they are "public servants" they should all be required to go to jail if they ever vote to spend more money than has been allocated for the fiscal year.

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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Republicans refuse to compromise on tax hikes because they know you don't raise taxes in a recession. Look back at what Obama said, he knew that too when he signed the bill extending the Bush cuts. Somehow he got stupid over the last 10 months. Republicans also know that taxes are high enough right now. Republicans do not believe that taxes should be any higher.

    Conversely, couldn't we conclude that Democrat stubbornness on any spending cut compromises means that they believe government is as small as it should be and we are not wasting any money at all? Do Democrats think there is anywhere in our 25% over budget spending that could be cut? Or do they think we are running as lean and mean as absolutely possible? Maybe some of the Democrats and liberals here could chime in on that one.
    Get informed: UNICEF foreign adoption policy is killing orphans and the US gives $132 million to UNICEF every year. Stop the madness.
    For the best news and commentary on the 2012 election from the GOP perspective, visit www.whitehouse12.com.

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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by friday View Post
    It's not the same thing. Let me ask you a business question, let's say you own a used car dealership. If you raise the price on your 80s era Ford Escorts to $45,000, are you increasing revenues?
    That's a horrible analogy. Government taxation isn't the same thing as a firm increasing prices, for wholly obvious reasons.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    That's a horrible analogy. Government taxation isn't the same thing as a firm increasing prices, for wholly obvious reasons.
    Really? Then why don't we increase taxes across the board by 35% and eliminate the deficit? Won't a 35% tax hike across the board result in 35% more revenue?
    Get informed: UNICEF foreign adoption policy is killing orphans and the US gives $132 million to UNICEF every year. Stop the madness.
    For the best news and commentary on the 2012 election from the GOP perspective, visit www.whitehouse12.com.

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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by friday View Post
    Really? Then why don't we increase taxes across the board by 35% and eliminate the deficit? Won't a 35% tax hike across the board result in 35% more revenue?
    Like others have pointed out, some tax hikes make sense, others don't. We don't hike taxes by 35% across the board because

    1) that is just plain idiotic and would ruin the economy and
    2) there would be no political will to do so anyway.

    Doesn't take away from the fact that your Ford dealership analogy doesn't work

    What you're proposing is typical supply-side spin bullcrap. The only way your statement about revenue increases not being equivalent to tax increases would make sense would be if we were on the right side of the Laffer curve, which we are not.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Like others have pointed out, some tax hikes make sense, others don't. We don't hike taxes by 35% across the board because

    1) that is just plain idiotic and would ruin the economy and
    2) there would be no political will to do so anyway.

    Doesn't take away from the fact that your Ford dealership analogy doesn't work

    What you're proposing is typical supply-side spin bullcrap. The only way your statement about revenue increases not being equivalent to tax increases would make sense would be if we were on the right side of the Laffer curve, which we are not.
    Has it occurred to you that the reason there is no political will to raise taxes is because it is idiotic and would destroy the economy? Tell me what are smart tax hikes in an economic downturn? How do you smartly take money away from employers without hurting employment?
    Get informed: UNICEF foreign adoption policy is killing orphans and the US gives $132 million to UNICEF every year. Stop the madness.
    For the best news and commentary on the 2012 election from the GOP perspective, visit www.whitehouse12.com.

  10. #90
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    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by friday View Post
    Has it occurred to you that the reason there is no political will to raise taxes is because it is idiotic and would destroy the economy?
    Has it also occured to you that spending cuts in a recession don't help either? This is Econ101. Look at what austerity is doing to Greece. The problem lies in the fact that it's really hard to spur economic growth and close a deficit at the same time.

    There is no political will to raise taxes because

    1) nobody likes taxes, and
    2) Republicans since the late 80s to early 90s have adopted an orthodox, hardcore anti-tax position. It's about ideology more than it is about economics when you have 90+ percent of Republicans in Congress signing onto the Norquist pledge.

    Tell me what are smart tax hikes in an economic downturn? How do you smartly take money away from employers without hurting employment?
    Employment, and economic growth as a whole, is more a function of consumer demand than it is about how much cash businesses have on hand. You can cut taxes all you want, but if the demand isn't there, all you're going to have is folks pocketing the extra money rather than hiring people, because there's no money to be made when there's no business and demand.

    As others have proposed, close loopholes, simplify the tax code. Lower the overall rates somewhat, I personally would add more brackets. Tax capital gains at a slightly higher rate.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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