View Poll Results: Did Democrats cause the super committee to fail on purpose?

Voters
71. You may not vote on this poll
  • No, they actually thought a trillion dollar tax hike in a recession was reasonable

    9 12.68%
  • No, it was a bi-partisan failure

    28 39.44%
  • Yes, the plan from the beginning was to fail

    34 47.89%
Page 26 of 38 FirstFirst ... 16242526272836 ... LastLast
Results 251 to 260 of 372

Thread: They did it on purpose

  1. #251
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:41 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    89,832

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    The downtrodden rich should start their own civil rights movement. "Don't tax me, dude!"
    They have done just that for some time now. Their leader is Grover Norquist and his version of the "I Have A Dream" speech comes out as a nightmare for the rest of the nation. Their political arm is ALEC.
    Last edited by haymarket; 11-23-11 at 07:37 AM.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  2. #252
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 02:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,107

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by Karl View Post
    More brain dead supply side talking points
    let me get this straight. you consider the idea that more tax payers will increase tax revenues to be "brain dead". ?


    it just seems like you have said something abysmally stupid, and so I want to make sure that is what you meant before I proceed to laugh boisterously at your expense.

  3. #253
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 02:43 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,107

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    There are two sides to a budget. You learn that in week one of any basic accounting or bookkeeping course. Perhaps some attended a school where they could not afford to include all the information needed so the part about INCOME was cut out?
    Strawmen may be fun to argue, but doing so isn't a terribly strong signal of competence. No one is arguing that we shouldn't increase revenue - we are arguing about how to go about it.

    more specifically, you are advocating a method that has been demonstrated on multiple occasions not to actually - you know - work.

    you won't get more revenue by jacking up nominal rates. you get more revenue by increasing growth and getting people back to work. and you will never get enough revenue to fund the federal government at it's current size.

  4. #254
    Tavern Bartender
    Constitutionalist
    American's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Virginia
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 12:03 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    76,301

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    It's the same thing. And they are needed.
    How about revenue increases from import duties on Chinese goods?
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

  5. #255
    Dungeon Master
    Somewhere in Babylon
    Jetboogieman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Somewhere in Babylon...
    Last Seen
    @
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,295
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    How about revenue increases from import duties on Chinese goods?
    Yes start a trade war with your biggest creditor. Sounds like a plan.

  6. #256
    Sage
    German guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Last Seen
    08-24-17 @ 06:57 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    5,187

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    theft is a bunch of people who don't pay taxes getting together and jacking up the taxes on a minority that already pays a huge share of the taxes
    Yes. But by the same means, it's "class warfare" when high income people weasle out of their responsibility for their country on the cost of middle class and under class. Just that it's class warfare top-down.

    Everybody has to contribute his share. And he who is stronger, naturally has to bear more, IMO.
    "Not learning from mistakes is worse than committing mistakes. When you don't allow yourself to make mistakes, it is hard to be tolerant of others and it does not allow even God to be merciful."

  7. #257
    Sage
    German guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Berlin, Germany
    Last Seen
    08-24-17 @ 06:57 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    5,187

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You're preaching to the choir, pard. At no time did I suggest that we should abolish taxes. I don't even know where you're going with this.
    My point is that it seems obvious to me that everybody has to take off his ideological blinders, if we're interested in a compromise. Just like Democrats have to realize that a success isn't possible without cutting spending (including the social systems), Republicans have to lay off the "taxes are theft!"-rhetoric, and take taxes for what they are: A necessity to increase revenues and reduce the deficit.

    Of course I wasn't in the room when the talks failed, but based on what I read, I see the problem is on both sides. Each side had their "holy cows" they refused to touch. For Democrats, it was raising the retirement age or cutting healthcare subsidies, for Republicans, it was raising taxes. And now, both sides play the blame game, instead of getting their act together and actually do something for the country (and future generations).

    It seems both Dems and Reps were more interested in abusing these talks for the 2012 campaign, than in actually finding a solution.
    Last edited by German guy; 11-23-11 at 09:11 AM.
    "Not learning from mistakes is worse than committing mistakes. When you don't allow yourself to make mistakes, it is hard to be tolerant of others and it does not allow even God to be merciful."

  8. #258
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:41 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    89,832

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Strawmen may be fun to argue, but doing so isn't a terribly strong signal of competence. No one is arguing that we shouldn't increase revenue - we are arguing about how to go about it.

    more specifically, you are advocating a method that has been demonstrated on multiple occasions not to actually - you know - work.

    you won't get more revenue by jacking up nominal rates. you get more revenue by increasing growth and getting people back to work. and you will never get enough revenue to fund the federal government at it's current size.
    three points here
    1) your own link says this

    No doubt the majority of that loss in millionaire filings results from the recession.
    So your own article which you offer in evidence gives its main reason as something other than the point you are trying to make.
    2) people may be able to flee a state, but a national tax policy applies to all 50. Moving from Maryland to Virginia, or from Oregon or New York gains you nothing with a national tax.

    3)The Clinton years tax rates worked wonderfully both in collections and by increasing revenues significantly. So there is precedent for a tax policy that works and is higher than rates we currently have.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  9. #259
    long standing member
    justabubba's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:37 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    36,145

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Strawmen may be fun to argue, but doing so isn't a terribly strong signal of competence. No one is arguing that we shouldn't increase revenue - we are arguing about how to go about it.

    more specifically, you are advocating a method that has been demonstrated on multiple occasions not to actually - you know - work.

    you won't get more revenue by jacking up nominal rates. you get more revenue by increasing growth and getting people back to work. and you will never get enough revenue to fund the federal government at it's current size.
    [emphasis added by bubba]

    let's do the math

    larger coefficient multiplied times the taxable income > smaller coefficient multiplied times the taxable income

    plug in some numbers and see for yourself that your assertion is very wrong
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  10. #260
    Professor
    Keridan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Raleigh NC
    Last Seen
    08-19-17 @ 12:10 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    1,451

    Re: They did it on purpose

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    [emphasis added by bubba]

    let's do the math

    larger coefficient multiplied times the taxable income > smaller coefficient multiplied times the taxable income

    plug in some numbers and see for yourself that your assertion is very wrong
    Taxable income is a variable, not a constant, and is directly influenced by the coefficient.
    Omniscience just sucks without omnipotence!

Page 26 of 38 FirstFirst ... 16242526272836 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •