View Poll Results: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

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    36 36.73%
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Thread: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

  1. #651
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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    The north had NO authority to lay taxes and tariffs on specifically the goods produced by the southern region, that is found right in article 8.
    Article 8 of what? There are 7 articles in the Constitution.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    Nope. It was surrounded by the southern territory.
    South Carolina was surrounded by the Union until North Carolina and Georgia seceded.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

  3. #653
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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    Article 8 of what? There are 7 articles in the Constitution.
    My bad. Kind of posting in a hurry. Article 1 sec. 8, the general welfare clause. One of the provisions found within states that congress has the power to lay and collect taxes but it must be applied equally among the states.
    Neither side in an argument can find the truth when both make an absolute claim on it.

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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    My bad. Kind of posting in a hurry. Article 1 sec. 8, the general welfare clause. One of the provisions found within states that congress has the power to lay and collect taxes but it must be applied equally among the states.
    Fair enough, I wasn't sure what you were citing. As usual, when somebody cites the Constitution, I reach for the Constitution app on my phone. When I went to look it up in article 8, I couldn't find it!

    I'll have to look up what tariffs they were when I'm not busy. I recall it being about cotton, but it's not the north's fault that cotton doesn't grow in Minnesota. Before I pass judgement, I'll look them up when I can.


    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    This issue has been plowed more times than Paris Hilton.
    Quote Originally Posted by Oborosen View Post
    Too bad we have to observe human rights.

  5. #655
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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Perhaps I'm the only one who thinks this, but this really just comes down to perception.

    The South perceived themselves as independent, so according to them and those who see it their way - they were independent.

    The North perceived the South as treasonous members of the Union, so according to them and those who see it their way - the CSA was not independent.

    I could easily side with the South, but history tends to side with the North as no one ever becomes independent until they fight for it and win.
    I guess I am the only one.

    Cool. I'm fine with "I'm right. You're wrong. It has nothing to do with perspective."

    /back to that.

    I'm right, rocket88 is right. The rest of you are wrong.

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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    My bad. Kind of posting in a hurry. Article 1 sec. 8, the general welfare clause. One of the provisions found within states that congress has the power to lay and collect taxes but it must be applied equally among the states.
    The whole tariff issue is a farce. The North made the rights high until the Democrats gained power in Congress and brought them extremely low and the Southerners were very happy with the tariffs. Then Lincoln became president and they decided to secede. The idea that the south was fed up with the North over tariffs is nonsense. It was an issue, but a very small issue considering that for decades the South had continually lowering tariffs on their products right until Lincoln became president.

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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by LaMidRighter View Post
    It was on southern land, it was funded at least in part by southern dollars, the north and south split so the binding contracts and treaties were null and void. And finally, it was on southern land.
    The who paid taxes debate may be meaningless. If I am not mistaken, at that time in our history there were no federal income taxes. The military was funded by tariffs on imports. So do the "French" for example have a claim on the fort because we taxed their escargot imports?
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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by snilloctjc View Post
    The who paid taxes debate may be meaningless. If I am not mistaken, at that time in our history there were no federal income taxes. The military was funded by tariffs on imports. So do the "French" for example have a claim on the fort because we taxed their escargot imports?
    Yes, of course they do.

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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Perhaps I'm the only one who thinks this, but this really just comes down to perception.
    No it doesn't. You are only even saying this because your position has no feet.

    I could easily side with the South, but history tends to side with the North as no one ever becomes independent until they fight for it and win.
    Unless of course you understand the word union and the reason its called United States and the meaning of united and States. Why the ruling in 1869 was bogus, and what the introduction actually is for. Why the ruling was made, and what the tenth is actually for and does Or how just about what the founders said on the topic. If you understand all of that its pretty obvious you are full of it, but if you don't, well, sure lets go with that.

    I mean you know..
    Last edited by Henrin; 11-15-11 at 07:49 PM.

  10. #660
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    Re: Is the Confederate flag a symbol of treason?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    No it doesn't. You are only even saying this because your position has no feet.
    LOL, no. I have never had problems standing by my positions. I actually made the same argument yesterday because it's true. Property is subjective in its nature, particularly when it comes to nations and states. Consequently, who has a right to what property really just depends on which side you're coming from which is why the "right side" of civil wars (any civil war) is always hard to decipher and is often a point of contention among historians.

    Nonetheless, while I recognize the subjectivity, I still take the side of Lincoln, the Supreme Court and the Union in general simply because history does not agree with your (and the Confederacy's position). If you look at history, you'll notice a theme. The theme is that many groups declare independence, but not all of them actually acquire it. The Confederacy is one of those groups. Look at every fight for independence - we don't call those fighting "independent" unless they actually win. The Confederacy is no different. It lost. It never achieved what it set out to achieve.

    Unless of course you understand the word union and the reason its called United States and the meaning of united and States. Why the ruling in 1869 was bogus, and what the introduction actually is for. Why the ruling was made, and what the tenth is actually for and does Or how just about what the founders said on the topic. If you understand all of that its pretty obvious you are full of it, but if you don't, well, sure lets go with that.

    I mean you know..
    The only way for you to rationalize your position is to insult me and others. This says a lot about you and the weakness of your position. It's actually a shame because your position has validity all on it's own without the cheap shots.

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