You see Henrin, the argument means nothing to me. What does mean something to me is the reality of the events as they actually did happen and that is reflected in the historical record.
There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers
I once bought the argument that the South was not fighting to preserve slavery, further study and reflection has led me to the conclusion that I was buying a revisionist history. Slavery was exactly the fight. Remember it is not the common soldier (or even professional soldier in a free society) or citizen that starts wars or decides their reasons, it is the elite (political, economic...) for the elite of the period it was slavery and its pepetuation that brought them to secession.
in unspoken fears.
I just don't think we should give a damn....
The South got angry for whatever reason they got angry for.
The South Succeeded.
The South told Yankees get the hell out. (Fort Sumter)
Yankees didn't get the hell out.
The South attacks (Doesn't invade).
The Yankees invade.
Them damn yankees win.
Its over and done with. The confederate flag can mean whatever the hell you want it too mean!
But this is America... and were supposed to be free damn it.
That means free to hate America and free to be racist... as long as you don't act upon it.
Last edited by Free For All; 11-15-11 at 09:01 AM.
The Nazi flag is a symbol of hate. That's the appropriate comparison.Probably no worse or better than the German flag is currently. I've heard that the Confederate flag is a symbol of slavery. If so then why isn't the German flag a symbol of Jewish hate?
"It ain't what they call you, it's what you answer to." - W. C. Fields
I intentionally used the German flag instead of the Nazi flag (well banners really, I don't think I've ever really seen a Nazi flag before) because regardless of the party running it Germany was the country that was exterminating Jews. Likewise regardless of the people running it, elite or otherwise, the CSA was the country wanting to keep slavery. I find it an apt comparison.
to snilloctjc: from my readings over the years, while slavery was among the issues, it was not the top issue (although certainly up there). So I need to disagree with your implied premise that the attempted secession was about preserving slavery. I will grant that I may be misreading in that you may have once believe that slavery wasn't an issue at all and have since revised. I certainly don't fool myself that slavery wasn't on the table. I just find no evidence that it was the only or main issue.
States Rights - what right were they determined to perserve? The right to rule on the issue of slavery
Economics - That peculiar institution was necessary to keep the agriculutural engine running - keep slaves
Nullification - the laws they wished to nullify were laws concerning slavery
Sorry but I can find no other reason more powerful than the fight to maintain slavery. Look at the legal and physical battles leading up to the civil war. Dredd Scott, decision, Missouri/Maine Compromise, etc - all were attempts to mitigate the slave issue, and preserve the union.
Other than taking the argument down to individual people there was no issue greater than that of slavery. It fueled the passions of both sides to the point of civil war
in unspoken fears.