View Poll Results: Pick any that fit your view

Voters
18. You may not vote on this poll
  • If you are poor it is your own fault.

    4 22.22%
  • The poor should not be able to vote or their vote should count less.

    1 5.56%
  • We should institute a flat tax, remove unions, remove minimum wage, and cut welfare.

    4 22.22%
  • Abortion is murder.

    10 55.56%
  • Most universities and institutions of science are liberal leaning because of grant money.

    2 11.11%
  • The United States is a Christian nation.

    4 22.22%
  • The death penalty is an important part of the justice system.

    6 33.33%
  • AGW is not real.

    2 11.11%
  • We should not invest in alternative energy but should instead focus on fossil fuels and drilling.

    4 22.22%
  • I am a conservative or libertarian

    16 88.89%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

  1. #11
    Sage
    whysoserious's Avatar
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    meh, no biggie.. people who want to participate will let their opinions be known regardless.

    the problem with polls presented by one side of the political spectrum, and aimed at the other side, is that there will be bias present... and even a few strawmen-like options.
    for example , your last option..
    "If we removed all regulations, the free market would benefit everyone." is a not an accurate representation of conservative or libertarian dogma.. it's representative of anarchy.
    neither libertarians nor conservatives espouse the desire to remove all regulations.
    proponents of fewer regulations, who are primarily conservatives and libertarians, can't honestly vote for your last option.

    it's also not good form to offer an option that entails a preset cause.
    for example..
    "Most universities and institutions of science are liberal leaning because of grant money."
    what if a person thinks these universities are liberal for a reason other than "....because of grant money"?

    it's imperative to present the options in the most unbiased fashion possible
    I tried to make them as straightforward as possible. I am a biased person, as we all are, so I wouldn't be surprised if there was some hint in there, but I also tried to only include things I have read on this board. For instance, as far as removing regulations, a few days ago I had this argument with a libertarian on this board:

    Henrin on removing regulations
    As I argued before there is no need for regulations. There is merely a need for courts with access and punishments.
    Now I see your point about the universities and scientific institutions option, but I did not want the question to only be them being liberal. I think we'd all agree that most universities are liberal, but there is definitely a group of people who believe that these political leanings are a direct result of the funding received. I am fine with the fact that none of these options don't fit you, but I think almost every one of these options will fit someone's point of view on this board.

  2. #12
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    That's why I didn't vote for that option. I want fewer, even much less regulation in the market, but certainly not no regulation at all.

    Also, "AGW is not real" in the context of how libs sell it. The climate is changing, but it's not the apocalypses liberals propheci.

    I know population wasn't on th list, but folks will discover that we could actually be in a low-population crisis within a couple hounded years.

    "Abortion is murder". Not always, as homicide can and frequently is justified. I went ahead and agreed with it because abortion today is being used irresponsibly.
    Yes, but AGW is the belief that man causes the climate change. As far as the "Abortion is murder" option, do you not think there are some that agree? If you don't agree then don't mark it.

    *Edit to add:

    By the way, so far there is only one choice that hasn't been picked out of 5 voters, so they cannot be that poorly written (and that choice will obviously be selected eventually judging by the threads currently open on the subject).
    Last edited by whysoserious; 10-30-11 at 01:45 PM.

  3. #13
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    Libertarian....

    none of the above....not in the form they are presented, anyways.
    yeah, this seems a way to reduce a paragraph argument into a bullet point strawman.

    If you are poor it is your own fault.
    generally poverty is the result of behavior - the most common cause of poverty is divorce or not marrying the parent of your children. according to Pew Research, the next most likely indicator is if you have used crack. the fourth is if you failed to graduate high school. certainly not all poor are poor because of their decisions, but the wide majority who remain poor are poor because of their behaviors.

    The poor should not be able to vote or their vote should count less.
    we've addressed this in the other thread. those who live off the subsistence of others should not be given the ability to wield the coercive power of the state to threaten those others with retribution if they do not give them ever-increasing amounts.

    We should institute a flat tax, remove unions, remove minimum wage, and cut welfare.
    flat tax with a floor -yes, remove unions - only government ones, remove minimum wage - yes, reduce welfare expenditures in reforms of the system that produce superior results at less cost - yes.

    Abortion is murder.
    A baby is a baby. Killing babies because they are inconvenient, yes, is murder.

    Most universities and institutions of science are liberal leaning because of grant money.
    yes and no - grant money pulls, but most universities are liberal leaning because of the faculty.

    The United States is a Christian nation.
    we are a faithful agnostic nation within the general historical framework of Christianity.

    The death penalty is an important part of the justice system.
    yes and should be applied much more rapidly and publicly.

    AGW is not real.
    certainly we have learned that the "overwhelming science behind it" seems to have been all-too-often the product of book-cooking or expulsion of contradicting evidence and interpretations of data. i would say that we have nothing near the kind of certainty or ability to effect any AGW that is going on to wreck our economy based off of...

    We should not invest in alternative energy but should instead focus on fossil fuels and drilling.
    we should allow the private market to fully invest in all of these things, and tell government to stay the F out of the business of picking winners and losers.

    I am a conservative or libertarian
    naturally

  4. #14
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    too many absolutes. there are some poor people who are poor through no fault of their own. a flat tax is not the best option. The USA has no official religion. The death penalty is not carried out properly, abortion by definition cannot be murder, and we should look for other forms of energy. The AGW bit is still undeterminable and finally people should not have a say in raising taxes they don't pay but I don't think the absolute about the poor makes sense



  5. #15
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    I could only vote for Abortion is murder.... the rest of the options had one or more things in them where I couldn't vote for it... the unions item for example. If people want unions they should be allowed to create them... if the union item was out of that option I could have voted for it.
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  6. #16
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    Perhaps "abortion is homicide" would be a better choice than simply "murder."
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  7. #17
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    If you are poor it is your own fault.
    Sometimes.
    There are a lot of differing circumstances in life.

    The poor should not be able to vote or their vote should count less.
    Nah, they don't vote anyway, for the most part.

    We should institute a flat tax, remove unions, remove minimum wage, and cut welfare.
    Depends.
    Too much in this to really make a straight, yes or no.

    Abortion is murder.
    I don't care if people get abortions.
    Although personally I think it's dumb.
    If you wish to voluntarily remove your potential progeny from the gene pool, you're probably doing the rest of us a favor.

    Most universities and institutions of science are liberal leaning because of grant money.
    I'd say that the staff tends to lean liberal, not necessarily because of grant money.

    The United States is a Christian nation.
    Most people observe some form of Christianity, whether they are practicing or non practicing.
    Although I don't think the U.S. should be exclusively Christian.

    The death penalty is an important part of the justice system.
    I don't approve of it.

    AGW is not real.
    I'm fine with reasonable environmental regulation.
    AGW, don't know and really don't care.

    We should not invest in alternative energy but should instead focus on fossil fuels and drilling.
    Alternative energy "investment" has cost consumers a lot for very little, in my opinion.
    I prefer the market it sort out what is best.

    I am a conservative or libertarian.
    I don't like being grouped with conservatives because our motivations can be very different, even if we have some similarities.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  8. #18
    Dispenser of Negativity
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    Abortion is murder is the only one I could vote for, too much grey area in the others.
    Jackboots always come in matched pairs, a left boot and a right boot.

  9. #19
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    Yes, but AGW is the belief that man causes the climate change. As far as the "Abortion is murder" option, do you not think there are some that agree? If you don't agree then don't mark it.
    I marked it because the earth has survived much worse then Man.

  10. #20
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    Re: A Poll for Conservatives (and Libertarians)

    right libertarian, and I voted for a couple of things, but most of the options I chose have ifs, ands, and buts.

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