View Poll Results: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

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    11 31.43%
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    7 20.00%
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Thread: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

  1. #11
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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    Quote Originally Posted by dumbasdirt View Post
    This is my opinion; I stand by what I say and will debate you my points. OK, that being said let’s get to the heart of the problem. Is our economic crisis Obama’s fault, or is the blame being placed in the wrong place? If you have lived in this country for all your life; like I have, then I think you will agree with what I have to say. I have lived and worked in this country and I have seen this economic crisis coming for years. I saw it with Reagan with his tickle down economics; I think everybody understands that money does not follow down from the top, when money gets to the top it stays there; more profits for the shareholders, not to be gave to the employs, what have they done to deserve anything. He also didn’t raise the minim wage his two terms as President; keeping the labor cost down for the corporations and keeping the working class people in near slavery conditions. And then after the crippling years of Reagan; for the working class, then along came G H W Bush; no new taxes, he was a liar right out of the box. Then he did the worst thing that has ever been done to the working class of this country, he signed the Free Trade Agreement. I don’t know where you were at when this happened; but were I am at, there was a big sucking sound, and that was the jobs going over sea, were the corporations could get real slaves to do their labor for them. Where I live factories closed, there were mills closing, and the manufacturing jobs were all gone. The large chain stores moved in with their low price product form China, and there went the Mom & Pop store, because the people with jobs had no choice but to buy what they could afford. How many American jobs were lost because of what GHW Bush had done? Now I know there are thing that we need from overseas; such as oil, but I think instead of Free Trade Agreement we should have had a Fair Trade Agreement, a bushel of corn for a barrel of oil, if they don’t like the trade we offer; then let them eat that oil and sand they have, and we need to find other way to replace oil and let them starve; I’m sorry for being so bunt, but we have an obligation to the people of this country first and foremost. Then we had eight years of Bill Clinton; what can I say about Wild Bill, he stayed in so much trouble that he could be made to do anything by anybody that had seen him with his hand in the cookie jar; and that was a lot of people, so I think he was more or less a puppet. G W Bush, why attack Afghanistan, when all the Muslim country have the same view and believe America is evil. All we did was take over a war that Russia had already gave up on. There are foreign countries that we send billions of dollars to every year, there are corporations and banks that we bailed out, and this is on the back of the American people. Now tell me, who is the one with their hand out; waiting on something free from the government. Now if you still think that Obama is to blame for the economic crisis, you’re either blind, too young to really know the facts, or either you are rich or have a corporation, and you don’t want your dream world destroyed. I have voted republican all my life, I didn’t even vote for Obama in the last election, but I have seen the light so to speak, and I hope other will also see the light, or I’m afraid if a republican get in office that our way of life and our freedoms are in danger of be taken from us. So if all the people marching haven’t choose a name yet, let me suggest one for you Americans for Freedom. Keep marching, your voice is getting out, don’t let the right wing republicans silent your voice with their propaganda. No real American thinks you are a bunch crazy’s just wanting a free hand out, the republicans are just scared they are finally going to have to pay their fair share. We have a man in office that has said he would stand with the American people, and this is got the republicans really scared and they are doing everything they can to discredit him. So he has said he will stand with us, now we have to say we will stand with him. Eighty present of this country has a loud voice when it comes together, and this has the republicans scared that their way of life is coming to an end. Americans for Freedom needs to put up a web site to get donation and to spread their message out to the people they’re fight for, I’m poor but I think I may be able to come up with a couple of dollars to get my voice heard. We have got them scared, there on the ropes, time to go in for the kill. I would prefer four more years of Obama, and try to get some hope and change for the working class of this country, than put any republican in any office, President or congress. But that is my opinion. And the question is where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country? Do you real think that Obama has put this country in the crisis it is in, in the last two or three years he’s been in office? Or is it the politics of the republicans for the last thirty years to blame for the country’s problems? I’m saying thirty years, because that is the time I have lived and worked in this country, I’m sure it is probably a lot longer.
    The poll intro and this book description might go well together. Rhetoric and manifesto come to mind with both.

    Personally, I blame anyone who intentionally diminishes the importance of personal responsibility.

    If I have to choose politicians to blame, I'll say democrats in the House and Senate. In my opinion, we've taken the most positive steps as a country when republicans controlled both House and Senate and and the most negative steps when Democrats held both. When the House and Senate are split, they tend to bicker a lot but mostly just maintain the status quo.
    The US is an odd ship. The captain yells out when he sees obtacles , but 535 individual propellers do the steering.

  2. #12
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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Okay, we elected these people. What they did or didn't do after being elected is on them, but giving them the power to make those decisions is on us. Also, I'm not sure why the democrats aren't mentioned as having a hand in this. We didn't have a republican majority in the house and senate for 30 years. We didn't have republican presidents all 30 years. We have a mixed-party government and they made mixed party decisions. Some of the legislation from both sides was detrimental, some of it was beneficial, and some of the bipartisan stuff fell much the same way.
    I know that we elected the leaders that have brought this contry to its knees. The reason I didn't mention congress is because it seems to me that ever republican is puting all the blame on Obama, saying that he has caused this economic crisis because he is President at the time it is going on.That why I only put the blame at the top, he was the President so what ever happened while he was President was his fault. The economic problems we are having were started a long time ago, and any one that says it it Obama economy is either dumb as drit or just trying to put the blame on somebody for the polotics of the past.

  3. #13
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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    Quote Originally Posted by GreenvilleGrows View Post
    The poll intro and this book description might go well together. Rhetoric and manifesto come to mind with both.

    Personally, I blame anyone who intentionally diminishes the importance of personal responsibility.

    If I have to choose politicians to blame, I'll say democrats in the House and Senate. In my opinion, we've taken the most positive steps as a country when republicans controlled both House and Senate and and the most negative steps when Democrats held both. When the House and Senate are split, they tend to bicker a lot but mostly just maintain the status quo.
    Well the rpublicans have had their party in the Presidental position for 24 years of the last 32years, and that 8 years the republicans were not in office they had a puppet in the office of President. The point I'm trying to make is that Obama could not have caused the problems we have now, no way we got here in two or three years.

  4. #14
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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    Quote Originally Posted by dumbasdirt View Post
    I know that we elected the leaders that have brought this contry to its knees. The reason I didn't mention congress is because it seems to me that ever republican is puting all the blame on Obama, saying that he has caused this economic crisis because he is President at the time it is going on.That why I only put the blame at the top, he was the President so what ever happened while he was President was his fault. The economic problems we are having were started a long time ago, and any one that says it it Obama economy is either dumb as drit or just trying to put the blame on somebody for the polotics of the past.
    Respectfully, I'd say that no one has put more blame on somebody in the past than President Obama. If we listened to him on this, he'd have no part in what's happening at all. When I listen to him, he always sounds like he intends to be President next week instead of like he was elected the end of 2008. Democrats held the House and Senate majorities from 2007 to 2010.
    The US is an odd ship. The captain yells out when he sees obtacles , but 535 individual propellers do the steering.

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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    I blame neither Democrats nor Republicans.

  6. #16
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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    The blame lies with all --- Dems, GOP, and us. We have allowed for the last 25-30 years - our system to be corrupted and manipulated. We've lost our way politically, have given too much power to the Executive branch, and have lost our spine to stand up for the Constitution. This has trickled down into all branches of government, into the courts etc. We have Congress giving up it's power because it does not have the intestinal fortitude to stand up for what is right - instead the Congress stands up for what will get them re-elected. The Executive branch has taken the power given it by Congress and (with good intentions) has levied policy by fiat in some cases which had (at the time) unexpected consequences and which turned out to be a bad idea. Our Supreme Court is littered not with the ability or will to address how law is interpreted and how it applies to the Constitution, but it has been infected with political activists with an agenda towards supporting an ideology / political policy.

    We're a diseased country - we've lost our way, our politicians say one thing but do similar things to make a career out of politics. We're corrupt, spineless, and have created a political class that is above it all while pitting their constituents against each other every election cycle to perpetuate that political class and extending the disease.


    That is why the cure for the disease are people who do not care to be re-elected, who do not want be a career politician but who (from many political viewpoints) want to fix our system so it can work properly again and do the right thing, instead of the politically correct, politically expedient thing. Plain talkers who don't give a **** about getting re-elected who have character and who tell it like it is - even when we don't want to hear it. That's what we need... what we get are more turds in the punchbowl.
    “I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on what’s being proposed here, he’d agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute.” - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  7. #17
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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    It's the same screwed up system that has been causing these kinds of problems for hundreds of years. A small group of powerful, wealthy individuals, use that power and wealth to organize as much of the economy and society as they can towards obtaining more power and wealth for themselves. It's no wonder that recessions like this happen. There is no mechanism for the labor of the masses to benefit anyone but the upper crust. It simply doesn't exist. Well... we could vote for policy that benefits the middle and lower classes, but in this country, despite one of the founding ideals being abolition of the aristocracy, find it abhorrent to attack concentrated, inherited wealth and power.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    This was caused by the burst of the housing bubble. The burst of the housing bubble was caused by the bubble. That's what bubbles do; they burst. The housing bubble was caused by government policies, so the question becomes: who supported those policies? The answer is: (drum roll please) EVERYBODY! These policies were so popular among the voters that politicians in Washington, from BOTH parties, supported those policies in large numbers. For either party to blame the other is laughable.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  9. #19
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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    This was caused by the burst of the housing bubble. The burst of the housing bubble was caused by the bubble. That's what bubbles do; they burst. The housing bubble was caused by government policies, so the question becomes: who supported those policies? The answer is: (drum roll please) EVERYBODY! These policies were so popular among the voters that politicians in Washington, from BOTH parties, supported those policies in large numbers. For either party to blame the other is laughable.
    The housing crisis is a part of the problem, but not THE problem. There are MANY factors that have gone into the collaps of the economy but it starts with complacency, lack of vision, and lack of responsibility. We were so successful for so many years that we just kept blindly jogging along assuming it would saty that way forever. People stopped being personally responsible and started living selfish 'in the moment' lives. They stopped teaching their children about responsibility and stopped having high expectations of them. They became very self drven and motivated. The economy shifted to a service based economy. Because people were doing so well they began to trust money earning money in the markets...theyWANTED the markets to make them wealthy so they didnt care the industry jobs were shipped overseas for cheap labor. Industry and labor leaders were both more profit and bottom line driven than future and goal oriented driven...they stopped planning for tomorrow. They ignored the basic reality of business...you cant have profit if you dont have consumers that can afford your product. Government had no insight or vision and focused only on party and power. Instead of doing what is right for the country or even their constituents, they simply did what they needed to do to get reelected. The housing market was nothing more than a pyramid scheme...a get rich quick plan that middle income folks jumped on, upper income folks jumped in on and everyone including the shareholders in the banks profitted from.

    Vision. We have had no vision in this country since the 50's and 60'. We 'arrived'...and got complacent.

    You are right though...EVERYONE is part of the problem.

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    Re: Where do we put the blame for the crisis in this country?

    Quote Originally Posted by dumbasdirt View Post
    What option would you add to the poll?
    All of the above plus a few others. There is no one any person or group responsible on their own.

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