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Thread: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

  1. #21
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    Is the purpose of education to provide a citizenry best able to make political choices for itself, or to produce a citizenry capable of succeeding in the workplace?

    because an argument can be made for both, and currently we are not providing for either - at current schools do not overemphasize liberal arts so much as they overemphasize self-esteem.
    Does this have to be a choice between one and the other? I see many school doing both and doing it rather well.
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  2. #22
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    I wish I had been taught hard lessons, rigour, and most impoprtantly, self examination and self discipline.., at all stages of instruction. The few classes I had that were relatively strict, organized, and disciplined, I learned a crap-ton from, and actually remembered much of it. And I disliked them the most at the time...

    I don't oppose liberal arts in schools. I just think we have so much more we can be doing in the non-liberal arts side, that has a far greater impact on our lives, our culture, our economy and prosperity, etc. Someone else mentioned it's liberalism, not liberal arts...I can see some truth in that. Babying kids is not what kids need.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    You must have one of those cool schools of the future if you're getting to take classes in Greek mythology. After all, school is the only place you can learn that kind of thing!Need I go on, or have I made my point without poking too much fun?
    I took Mythology class. I loved it. We had a toga party and banquet at year end to boot.

    It was also a complete waste of educational time. I knew most of it already by reading a handful of norse/greek mythology books, and watching all of the Jason and the Argonauts, Clash of the Titans, etc., type movies. It was like a social group...not education.
    Last edited by Mach; 09-22-11 at 07:09 PM.

  3. #23
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    This is true, but I don't believe it's due to too much liberal arts. I think it's the exact opposite. I think the rigor of school is toned down after elementary school and continues to decline until about 2nd year in college. Instead, we should not allow that decline but rather keep it rigorous throughout. We should emphasis MORE liberal arts, not less. As time marches on and human society expands its knowledge and technology, there will be more and more to learn. It's how it works with us. We aggregate our knowledge base to push forward current technology. "If I have seen farther than any man, it is because I stood on the shoulders of giants" the saying goes. We continually must climb higher and higher as our aggregated knowledge increases. Is it necessary for everyone to know the intricacies of quantum mechanics? Not from a cog perspective, most certainly not. But from a human perspective it is good to have some knowledge of quantum even if it's remedial.

    To learn is to be human.
    Currently our solution, from the liberal arts regime, to shortages of scientists and engineers, is to cast out nets among the general population by compelling general study of the sciences in hopes of attracting some interest. Rather, we should mandate science courses (like those introductory level courses in college) that increase knowledge and appreciation of the scientific method and the most debated ideas of the scientific community rather than commonly agreed upon facts and theories used by scientists and experiments that displaying them. That's because the only function most people will need to perform when it comes to science is evaluating its socio-economic and political implications. There is no perfect way for a non-scientist to do that, but actually trying to teach students to fiddle around with physics is pointless, because most of them don't want to learn it. Actual physics study should be for people who display show potential as natural scientists during different 'testing periods' incorporated into the vocational study method; students who choose is as an elective, or because of government incentives (to increase the pool of scientists and engineers).
    Last edited by Morality Games; 09-22-11 at 07:08 PM.
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Currently our solution, from the liberal arts regime, to shortages of scientists and engineers, is to cast out nets among the general population by compelling general study of the sciences in hopes of attracting some interest. Rather, we should mandate science courses (like those introductory level courses in college) that increase knowledge and appreciation of the scientific method and the most debated ideas of the scientific community rather than commonly agreed upon facts and theories used by scientists and experiments that displaying them. That's because the only function most people will need to perform when it comes to science is evaluating its socio-economic and political implications. There is no perfect way for a non-scientist to do that, but actually trying to teach students to fiddle around with physics is pointless, because most of them don't want to learn it. Actual physics study should be for people who display show potential as natural scientists during different 'testing periods' incorporated into the vocational study method; students who choose is as an elective, or because of government incentives (to increase the pool of scientists and engineers).
    What "liberal arts regime"? I'm not aware of one.

  5. #25
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Currently our solution, from the liberal arts regime, to shortages of scientists and engineers, is to cast out nets among the general population by compelling general study of the sciences in hopes of attracting some interest. Rather, we should mandate science courses (like those introductory level courses in college) that increase knowledge and appreciation of the scientific method and the most debated ideas of the scientific community rather than commonly agreed upon facts and theories used by scientists and experiments that displaying them. That's because the only function most people will need to perform when it comes to science is evaluating its socio-economic and political implications. There is no perfect way for a non-scientist to do that, but actually trying to teach students to fiddle around with physics is pointless, because most of them don't want to learn it. Actual physics study should be for people who display show potential as natural scientists during different 'testing periods' incorporated into the vocational study method; students who choose is as an elective, or because of government incentives (to increase the pool of scientists and engineers).
    I don't wanna pay taxes, but I still got to do it. By relaxing the standards such that kids don't have to take tough courses because they have no interest in being challenged isn't, IMO, a good thing. People should have some understanding of base biology, chemistry, physics, and math. These are some of the most important things along with philosophy, art, and music, that humans have come up with. It in essence defines our species a bit.

    Your method is very much closer to the Japanese method wherein career is decided by the time someone hits Jr. High. There's a reason their teen suicide rate is so high. My method of broad range, but evenly applied works with people being able to make up their own minds when they are getting out of High School or are in College as to what career they want. All doors are left open, not shut because we are interested in making cogs only. Cogs suck. They cannot adapt, they fit only one place. To be a cog is essentially to be nothing more than a monkey. However, we are human and humans learn and adapt. Rigorous liberal arts education teaches that. It is the reason why we should pursue it to a greater length than what we do now. Now we have the cog machine, but it's not that great of a system and we already see its failings. We've let academic standards slide already, and this is what we have because of it. We do not need to exacerbate the decline by creating weaker standards and teaching cog mentality. The solution is in fact the opposite. We should be more rigorous, more complete with our liberal arts education.

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  6. #26
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Yes. I think public education over emphasizes the liberal arts. I think students should be required to take more math and science courses versus taking art or music appreciation.
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  7. #27
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    Yes. I think public education over emphasizes the liberal arts. I think students should be required to take more math and science courses versus taking art or music appreciation.
    I'm assuming you're making a joke since math and science are part of the liberal arts.

    The contemporary liberal arts comprise studying literature, languages, philosophy, history, mathematics, and science.
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    no.

    it is important to look at education the way a football player looks at weightlifting. while few of the exercises will be performed directly on the field, the strength gained will be used in nearly every play. in the same way, the mental acuity gained from a diverse educational background can be applied to any career that the student may someday choose. a complete education is intellectual weightlifting.

  9. #29
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Does this have to be a choice between one and the other? I see many school doing both and doing it rather well.
    I have no doubt there are many individual schools that do. I was fortunate to attend a very good public school. our system does not - where the schools do, they are notable because they do.

  10. #30
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    Re: Does Public Education over emphasize the Liberal Arts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I'm assuming you're making a joke since math and science are part of the liberal arts.
    if "liberal arts" are expanded to include all areas of study.... yes. however, typically "Liberal Arts" refers to "humanities", while math and science go by the nomer of "hard" subjects.

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