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  • The TSA can do whateverthey want - including strip searches and body cavaty searches

    3 9.68%
  • The TSA should have limits on how invasive a search can be

    15 48.39%
  • The TSA is ineffective and should not exist at all

    11 35.48%
  • The TSA is necessary, but currently ineffective

    7 22.58%
  • The TSA is necessary and effective

    5 16.13%
  • The TSA should not exist (for reason(s) other than being ineffective)

    8 25.81%
  • The enhanced patdowns are excessive and need to be dropped.

    13 41.94%
  • The enhanced patdowns are excessive and need to be modified.

    6 19.35%
  • The enhanced patdowns are necessary to assure safety.

    3 9.68%
  • Less invasive and equally thorough methods are available.

    12 38.71%
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Thread: Opinions about the TSA and practices

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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    OK, so the number of people that could potentially be victimized is relevant to whether or not it's a violation of civil liberties? Fair enough, but then consider this: Someone could be carrying a nuclear weapon in their truck as they drive down the highway. Someone could be carrying a vial of smallpox as they walk down the street. Since these things could also kill tens of thousands of people, and since one could make an equally strong argument that people implicitly consent to searches by using public sidewalks and highways, do you think it's appropriate for police to search them without a warrant, probable cause, or consent?

    If not, why?..
    if the police have a reasonable suspicion that you may have an ABC weapon, they have the right to search you on the street or in your car, without a warrant.

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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    men should pat down men...women should pat down women.

    any TSA agent who abuses his authority or position should be fired and charged with sexual assault.

    that said, we need these security regulations to prevent another 9-11. its that simple.
    I was hoping I could be pat down by a pretty college girl with loose morales.

    However I do agree that women should be pat down by women.

  3. #83
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    if the police have a reasonable suspicion that you may have an ABC weapon, they have the right to search you on the street or in your car, without a warrant.
    But that's not the same thing. Assuming they DON'T have probable cause or a warrant (i.e. you're just some guy walking down the street or driving down the highway), should they be able to search you? If not, what makes these situations different from the airport?
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    But that's not the same thing. Assuming they DON'T have probable cause or a warrant (i.e. you're just some guy walking down the street or driving down the highway), should they be able to search you? If not, what makes these situations different from the airport?
    well for one thing, walking down the street does not put you under the jurisdiction of the Federal govt., due to the Commerce Clause.

    look, we can't have the police checking all 8 million people walking around NYC. it would be impossible to do.

    but we CAN check everyone going to board a place. a man with a gun on a plane can end up killing 10,000 people. a man with a gun on the streets of Brooklyn can't kill 10,000 people.

    got it?

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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    but we CAN check everyone going to board a place. a man with a gun on a plane can end up killing 10,000 people. a man with a gun on the streets of Brooklyn can't kill 10,000 people.

    got it?
    I don't think a man with a gun can kill 10,000 on a plane. Not anymore. How do you think he's going to do it? He might be able to kill a few hundred.

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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by vvx View Post
    I don't think a man with a gun can kill 10,000 on a plane. Not anymore. How do you think he's going to do it?...
    I've seen the pilots leave the cabin door open as folks enter & leave the plane.

    and even if they don't do that, all it takes is one pilot who opens the door after the hijacker threatens to cut the throat of is favorite stewardess, or of a 5 year old girl.

    what would you do, as a pilot, if a hijacker is threatening to cut off the head of a 3 year old girl, while the mother is begging and screaming to you to please open the door?
    Last edited by Thunder; 09-20-11 at 11:17 PM.

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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by vvx View Post
    I don't think a man with a gun can kill 10,000 on a plane. Not anymore. How do you think he's going to do it? He might be able to kill a few hundred.
    He wouldn't be dumb enough to shoot inside the cabin cause he may depressurize it. But if he can get control of the cockpit, all he needs is 10 minutes on Micorsoft's Flight Similator and he knows which way to push ailerons into the closest building. 10,000 may be extreme. But 1 life is not worth some upset passengers.

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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    well for one thing, walking down the street does not put you under the jurisdiction of the Federal govt., due to the Commerce Clause.
    OK, so it's just a jurisdiction issue? Do you think state and local cops have the right to randomly frisk if you walk down the street, or would that still be an unreasonable search and seizure?

    look, we can't have the police checking all 8 million people walking around NYC. it would be impossible to do.
    So then your argument is that we can't check everyone, but you aren't opposed to it in principle, and wouldn't view it as an affront to civil liberties if the cops DID check random people?

    but we CAN check everyone going to board a place.
    a man with a gun on a plane can end up killing 10,000 people. a man with a gun on the streets of Brooklyn can't kill 10,000 people.
    See above re: the idea of using planes as missiles becoming obsolete by 10 AM on 9/11. Incidentally, most of the TSA's invasive new security processes are designed to check for explosives, not boxcutters...weapons which the 9/11 hijackers didn't have, and which would negate the whole idea of using the plane to kill 10,000 people.

    got it?
    Incidentally, boxcutters have slipped through TSA security at least twice just in the past year. And those are just the incidents that we actually know about.
    Luggage With Box-Cutter And Taped Cell Phone Leads To International Investigation
    JFK Box-Cutters: TSA Misses Passenger Eusebio D. Peraltalajara Carrying Box-Cutters Through Security
    Last edited by Kandahar; 09-20-11 at 11:19 PM.
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Anybody else have anything new to try and prove the constitution is violated?

    Remember if it is the task should be easy.

    All you have to do is prove force and lack of consent in legality.
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Ive gotten through security at airports with my Leatherman. And I've heard that small screwdrivers and even small knives are allowed on planes. It doesn't take a large blade to cut someone's throat.

    And I could see a situation where the pilot opens the door, rather than having a hijacker cut the throat of a sweet little 5 year old girl, as the mother cries and begs for her daughter to be spared.

    hard choice, huh?

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