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  • The TSA can do whateverthey want - including strip searches and body cavaty searches

    3 9.68%
  • The TSA should have limits on how invasive a search can be

    15 48.39%
  • The TSA is ineffective and should not exist at all

    11 35.48%
  • The TSA is necessary, but currently ineffective

    7 22.58%
  • The TSA is necessary and effective

    5 16.13%
  • The TSA should not exist (for reason(s) other than being ineffective)

    8 25.81%
  • The enhanced patdowns are excessive and need to be dropped.

    13 41.94%
  • The enhanced patdowns are excessive and need to be modified.

    6 19.35%
  • The enhanced patdowns are necessary to assure safety.

    3 9.68%
  • Less invasive and equally thorough methods are available.

    12 38.71%
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Thread: Opinions about the TSA and practices

  1. #91
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    the answer is EASY
    to fly you agree to the searches, they are a packaged deal, everybody knows to fly you must get searched so there is CONSENT.
    So why can't we apply the same argument to other situations? Why can't we assume implied consent to be searched if you walk down a sidewalk, or drive down the highway?
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    So why can't we apply the same argument to other situations? Why can't we assume implied consent to be searched if you walk down a sidewalk, or drive down the highway?
    because Id like to participate in OBJECTIVE LOGICAL and RATIONAL debate.

    Trying to saying walking down the street is even close to the same ball park as flying is pure dishonesty.
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  3. #93
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder View Post
    Ive gotten through security at airports with my Leatherman. And I've heard that small screwdrivers and even small knives are allowed on planes. It doesn't take a large blade to cut someone's throat.

    And I could see a situation where the pilot opens the door, rather than having a hijacker cut the throat of a sweet little 5 year old girl, as the mother cries and begs for her daughter to be spared.

    hard choice, huh?
    I don't think it's a hard choice myself. Knowing what you are risking it's an easy choice. Yes, pre 9-11 you might think if you open the cabin door a terrorist might just be trying to hold your plane ransom or perhaps diverting your flight to disney land because he had a sudden urge to ride space mountain. I don't think anyone is as aware of the risks now as those that actually work in the flight industry. And it's not a choice only for the pilot, but for all of the passengers as well. Would the passengers even let it get that far? I doubt it.

    At any rate, if that's your fear, there is a much much cheaper and more effective solution. If the pilot can't open the door, he won't open the door. No matter what.

  4. #94
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    I accidentally took a backpacking combo-tool which included a four inch knife and a saw blade on a plane last fall. I forgot it was in the front pocket of my carry-on. And as I said earlier, I have been patted down several times and have no doubt at all that I could get a small gun on a plane without detection. If the pat downs were actually keeping us safe, I wouldn't mind them so much. But it is infuriating to be groped knowing that this is a farce.
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  5. #95
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    because Id like to participate in OBJECTIVE LOGICAL and RATIONAL debate.
    Right, that's what I'm doing, examining your logic. So correct me if I'm wrong: You're saying that there are certain circumstances where you give your implied consent to be searched (even if you don't want to be searched), because you always have the option of NOT participating in that activity. Correct?

    Trying to saying walking down the street is even close to the same ball park as flying is pure dishonesty.
    So what's the fundamental difference that makes it an unreasonable search and seizure in the one situation, but not the other?
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Right, that's what I'm doing, examining your logic. So correct me if I'm wrong: You're saying that there are certain circumstances where you give your implied consent to be searched (even if you don't want to be searched), because you always have the option of NOT participating in that activity. Correct?





    So what's the fundamental difference that makes it an unreasonable search and seizure in the one situation, but not the other?[/QUOTE]

    no you are not, theres nothing logical, rational and objective about comparing TSA Policies at the ariport to walking out your front door. Then you choose to ignore the reason I have already given by rewording the same questions.

    What you are trying to do is play some word game because you cant prove that the Constitution is being violated.

    This thread as popped up at least a half dozen times and every time 3-4 people cry that it violates the constitution and every time I ask how and foe proof and every time nobody can. The only offer EMOTIONS and illogical non-parallels. Well Ive spent enough time destroying nonsensical points so Im not interest in games or dishonesty.

    SO if you believe that the constitution is being violated please prove so in legality now.
    you can either do it or you cant.
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    Then you choose to ignore the reason I have already given by rewording the same questions.
    If you won't answer the question then it's rather difficult to have that logical/rational debate you supposedly want.
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    If you won't answer the question then it's rather difficult to have that logical/rational debate you supposedly want.
    I did, you want me to change or give a new answer, please see previous posts and you will find all you seek.

    The question I asked you need nothing from me, the TSA policy is in place, you know how and on what grounds it works, the constitution is already written and you know how that works.

    So do you believe its being violated and if so please prove so.

    This is way you are playing a game. I could think its ok to murder somebody because they smile too much but in legality it has no impact on whether its ok to murder someone for that LOL
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  9. #99
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    I did, you want me to change or give a new answer, please see previous posts and you will find all you seek.

    The question I asked you need nothing from me, the TSA policy is in place, you know how and on what grounds it works, the constitution is already written and you know how that works.
    Oh, so you're saying that people implicitly consent to TSA searches because they know how it works and they've come to expect it? So then in your view, there's not necessarily a constitutional reason why it would be illegitimate for a cop to randomly frisk someone on the sidewalk...it's just that the government hasn't yet made it clear that that's what people should expect when they walk down the sidewalk, and therefore there's no implied consent (yet).

    So by this logic, the power of the state to frisk people on the street is just a marketing problem for the government to overcome, rather than an inherent constitutional problem. What this boils down to is that you think that searches and seizures are legitimate simply because the state performs them on a regular basis...so if the state acted even MORE invasively then the Constitution would give it more leeway.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 09-20-11 at 11:58 PM.
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    Re: Opinions about the TSA and practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Oh, so you're saying that people implicitly consent to TSA searches because they know how it works and they've come to expect it? So then in your view, there's not necessarily a constitutional reason why it would be illegitimate for a cop to randomly frisk someone on the sidewalk...it's just that the government hasn't yet made it clear that that's what people should expect when they walk down the sidewalk, and therefore there's no implied consent (yet).

    So by this logic, the power of the state to frisk people on the street is just a marketing problem for the government to overcome, rather than an inherent constitutional problem. What this boils down to is that you think that searches and seizures are legitimate simply because the state performs them on a regular basis...so if the state acted even MORE invasively then the Constitution would give it more leeway.
    really? is that what I said? LMAO
    like I said I have no interest in dishonest debate.
    Let me know when you can prove in legality that the constitution is violated
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