View Poll Results: Do you think socialism could have succeeded if capitalism wasn't standing on the way?

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  • Don't know

    3 2.88%
  • Don't care

    3 2.88%
  • Absolutely

    10 9.62%
  • I think it could

    16 15.38%
  • I think it couldn't

    17 16.35%
  • No way

    55 52.88%
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Thread: Socialism could have succeeded?

  1. #41
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Socialism did succeed. It's called Norway, France, Germany, etc etc.
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  2. #42
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Proud South Korean View Post
    Socialism is a political system. Capitalism is an economic system. Most people don't realize comparing those two is illogical.
    On the issue, I disagree. Socialism is a political system in which the government wields immense power over the country politically. In that sense, many capitalistic countries were socialist such as South Korea during the 50s, 60s, 70s, and 80s. Socialism and capitalism coexisting together leads to what looks like fascism, which was what South Korea looked like during the 50s-80s. Fascist Italy and Nazi Germany were also socialist, and capitalistic (more like corporatism, but that's another story)
    The reason why socialism didn't succeed was because the ideology was born later than that of democracy, and was born in a time when democracy was the growing political fad. Granted, many countries became socialist, yet it was only in a short historical period of a century. In addition, socialism was also associated with brutality, communism, and persecution of freedom, which caused an avid aversion by the majority of the population in the democratic countries. All these factors ultimately lead to its demise
    No. Communism is a political system. Totalitarianism is also a political system. Socialism is a purely economic system.
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  3. #43
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by atrasicarius View Post
    Socialism did succeed. It's called Norway, France, Germany, etc etc.
    Except they aren't socialist.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  4. #44
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Well lets see, the entire reason why socialism exists is to ease the way to a communist society. So it's failed.
    So follow me into the desert
    As desperate as you are
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    And all the little pigs have God

  5. #45
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    Well lets see, the entire reason why socialism exists is to ease the way to a communist society. So it's failed.
    Only as Marx envisioned it.
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  6. #46
    Unnecessary Middleman Bardo's Avatar
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Not really, any country that you could possibly list as "socialist" is predominantly capitalist, with a teasing of socialism.
    Norway's public sector is just as large as it's private sector. This isn't what makes it socialist, but it shows that it's not predominantly capitalist. Like I said, it doesn't have a totally planned economy but it is a social-democracy.

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Food, education and medicine is socialized?
    Must have a different version of socialism than the standard definition.
    What exactly is the standard definition? When can a country be described as "socialist" and when can it be described as "capitalist"?


    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    Well lets see, the entire reason why socialism exists is to ease the way to a communist society. So it's failed.
    Marx isn't the god of socialism, it existed before Marx.

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    No, it is against human nature.
    Is that why there were collectivists before there were individualists?
    "It has been said that man is a rational animal. All my life I have been searching for evidence which could support this." Bertrand Russell

  7. #47
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    It worked very well in Catalonia and it didn't fail there due to any flaws in socialism it fell because it was crushed by Franco's Fascists. Trotsky himself even said that
    'its political and cultural level, the Spanish proletariat stood on the first day of the revolution, not below, but above the Russian proletariat at the beginning of 1917'
    In Homage to Catalonia Orwell describes it like this:

    The Anarchists were still in virtual control of Catalonia and the revolution was still in full swing. To anyone who had been there since the beginning it probably seemed even in December or January that the revolutionary period was ending; but when one came straight from England the aspect of Barcelona was something startling and overwhelming. It was the first time that I had ever been in a town where the working class was in the saddle. Practically every building of any size had been seized by the workers and was draped with red flags or with the red and black flag of the Anarchists; every wall was scrawled with the hammer and sickle and with the initials of the revolutionary parties; almost every church had been gutted and its images burnt. Churches here and there were being systematically demolished by gangs of workman. Every shop and cafe had an inscription saying that it had been collectivised;
    even the bootblacks had been collectivized and their boxes painted red and black. Waiters and shop-walkers looked you in the
    face and treated you as an equal. Servile and even ceremonial forms of speech had temporarily disappeared. Nobody said
    'Sen~or' or 'Don' ort even 'Usted'; everyone called everyone else 'Comrade' or 'Thou', and said 'Salud!' instead of 'Buenos
    dias'. Tipping had been forbidden by law since the time of Primo de Rivera; almost my first experience was receiving a lecture
    from a hotel manager for trying to tip a lift-boy. There were no private motor-cars, they had all been commandeered, and the
    trams and taxis and much of the other transport were painted red and black. The revolutionary posters were everywhere,
    flaming from the walls in clean reds and blues that made the few remaining advertisements look like daubs of mud. Down the
    Ramblas, the wide central artery of the town where crowds of people streamed constantly to and fro, the loud-speakers were
    bellowing revolutionary songs all day and far into the night. And it was the aspect of the crowds that was the queerest thing of
    all. In outward appearance it was a town in which the wealthy classes had practically ceased to exist. Except for a small
    number of women and foreigners there were no 'well-dressed' people at all. Practically everyone wore rough working-class
    clothes, or blue overalls or some variant of militia uniform. All this was queer and moving. There was much in this that I did not
    understand, in some ways I did not not even like it, but I recognized it immediately as a state of affairs worth fighting for. Also, I
    believed that things were as they appeared, that this was really a workers' State and that the entire bourgeoisie had either fled,
    been killed or voluntarily come over to the workers' side; I did not realise that great numbers of well-to-do bourgeois were
    simply lying low and disguising themselves as proletarians for the time being.

  8. #48
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Capitalism doesn't stand in the way of Socialism... Capitalism supports Socialism and keeps it alive.

    if it weren't for Capitalism, Socialism would be long dead and buried.

  9. #49
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    Except they aren't socialist.
    They are a mix of democratic socialism and regulated capitalism.


  10. #50
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    In theory socialism can work. However, due to human flaws I see it being abused and not working efficiently.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
    Tired of elections being between the lesser of two evils.

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