View Poll Results: Do you think socialism could have succeeded if capitalism wasn't standing on the way?

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  • Don't know

    3 2.88%
  • Don't care

    3 2.88%
  • Absolutely

    10 9.62%
  • I think it could

    16 15.38%
  • I think it couldn't

    17 16.35%
  • No way

    55 52.88%
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Thread: Socialism could have succeeded?

  1. #211
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bardo View Post
    Means of production would be commonly owned, but self managed by those who use it. The unionism is an aspect of syndicalism, not libertarian-socialism in general.
    Well, I'm certainly no expert on leftist libertarianism, but I do see your point. However, it seems that this self-mgmt would be subject to the will of the public (ie the people who own it) so therefore, it sounds like we're just quibbling over semantics (as is GI, but to a much greater extent). In the end, it's the public who manages it, but they do it by delegating it to unions.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  2. #212
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Wake View Post
    Is it true that with socialistic nations they eventually run out of other people's money?
    Yeah, just printing the money is so much different. Give me a break.
    Last edited by Canell; 09-19-11 at 04:55 PM.

  3. #213
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bardo
    Except for you know, libertarian socialism and anarcho-anything.
    Tell you what...I'll be fair. You show me any country even remotely successful on any level with any structure remotely related to libertarian socialism, and I'll retract my "all socialism is authoritarian" belief that I give ad nauseum.

    Just one...remotely related. I mean remooooooooootely.

  4. #214
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Maternity leave is so ****ing oppressive.
    So is better internet and public utilities
    and living under an economy not regulated by conflicting interests...

  5. #215
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Tell you what...I'll be fair. You show me any country even remotely successful on any level with any structure remotely related to libertarian socialism, and I'll retract my "all socialism is authoritarian" belief that I give ad nauseum.

    Just one...remotely related. I mean remooooooooootely.
    If you want to be fair, care to tell us about any country that's been even remotely successful with any structure remotely related to libertarianism?
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  6. #216
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bardo View Post
    Derpa derp
    Socialism in a nutshell.

  7. #217
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    The Homer's got dat socializm figyurd out.

  8. #218
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Tell you what...I'll be fair. You show me any country even remotely successful on any level with any structure remotely related to libertarian socialism, and I'll retract my "all socialism is authoritarian" belief that I give ad nauseum.

    Just one...remotely related. I mean remooooooooootely.
    This is a non-sequitur. A historical example of a ‘successful’ Libertarian Socialist society is not required to prove or disprove your thesis, which is wrong, incidentally.

    Since you asked; the best, and largest example would be the Anarchist dominated areas of Revolutionary Spain, like Catalonia. It was a more-or-less fully realized, modern, technologically sophisticated Libertarian Socialist society of hundreds of thousands, over a period of several years. I’d also mention the Ukrainian Makhnovischina. Smaller examples would include the Israeli Kibbutzim, Denmark’s Free Christiania, and the Mexican Zapatistas.
    Economic Left/Right: -7.25, Authoritarian/Libertarian:-7.13
    All over the place, from the popular culture to the propaganda system, there is constant pressure to make people feel that they are helpless, that the only role they can have is to ratify decisions and to consume. -Noam Chomsky

  9. #219
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    Tell you what...I'll be fair. You show me any country even remotely successful on any level with any structure remotely related to libertarian socialism, and I'll retract my "all socialism is authoritarian" belief that I give ad nauseum.

    Just one...remotely related. I mean remooooooooootely.
    Libertarian socialism, the best example is probably the Spanish Revolution. Of course, if you change that to democratic socialism, you've got most of Europe, Australia, Canada, Japan, etc etc etc.
    For: legalizing drugs, gay marriage, abortion, guns, universal health care, public sector jobs, nuclear power, free education, progressive taxation
    Against: corporations, make-work, the 40 hour work week, intellectual property, imperialism, "homeland security," censorship

  10. #220
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    Re: Socialism could have succeeded?

    Quote Originally Posted by atrasicarius View Post
    Libertarian socialism, the best example is probably the Spanish Revolution. Of course, if you change that to democratic socialism, you've got most of Europe, Australia, Canada, Japan, etc etc etc.
    By extension, United States is a democratic socialist country since Australia is more capitalist than the US? Although, there are no consensus what democratic socialism is, I think very few would agree with you there. Why do you keep insisting on putting socialist labels on capitalist countries?

    Today, we call countries like Germany, France,Italy, and Sweden social democratic. Not democratic socialism. Countries like the US, Australia, Canada and Switzerland are following the anglo-saxon model.

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