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Thread: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    No one else could do it. Even if private corporations had any interest in helping those who can't make them rich, they don't have the massive amount of infrastructure to make it happen. But seriously, if you want government to be more effective at running the programs it takes on, stop handcuffing it. Get the private interests away from government. Get out the lobby money, get out the corporate campaign donations. Those massive 2000 page bills will shrink pretty quickly if they only need to tackle one issue. And then stop funneling money into the upper classes, where it does no one any good. Government is ineffective because we make it that way. Give it the means to accomplish the tasks we set it to, and it will be able to do them.

    But it already does most things better than the private sector.
    And for less money. Some people seem to think that transferring all health care insurance to the private sector is going to save them money, when in fact it will just make it more expensive for everyone by adding increased administration cost and profit.

    It will only make health care even more expensive than it already is. I fail to see how this would be an improvement.
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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    I don't, please define "enough" for the class. Is it catastrophic care? Is it preventative care? Is it anything that you can possibly have a doctor do, necessary or not? I guarantee you'll never get any agreement from everyone on what "enough" actually means.
    As I said, it's hard to define. Yes, it's preventative care. No, it's not elective surgery and procedures. Basically, you have a certain amount of money to spend on health care. Someone's going to have to make a system for determining who gets what treatments based on the cost, the severity of the condition, how old the patient is, how common the condition is, and so on. Enough is basically the best we can reasonably do at any given time.
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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    Quote Originally Posted by RiverDad View Post
    You're undermining the whole case for UHC. Look at what's going on in Canada. It used to be the case, and I think it still might be in some provinces, that you couldn't buy additional care. They frame this debate as "two-tier" health care. One side wants to have a system where one can buy additional care or just leave the public system. The other side is adamantly opposed to this because it will privilege those with resources over those without the same level of resources. This latter group is actively working to restrict the system to a one-payer model.
    Australia has a two tier system - more or less. We all pay into the "free health" scheme but if we want to go private we can. It is the best of both worlds actually
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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    Quote Originally Posted by bowerbird View Post
    Australia has a two tier system - more or less. We all pay into the "free health" scheme but if we want to go private we can. It is the best of both worlds actually
    So basically Aussie has a taxed system to pay for Universal health care to cover everyone...and if you have the money to pay for cadillac private care you can....isnt that the same for any country that has universal healthcare....if your rich you can use a paid private system ?

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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    Reading through this thread theres alot of ideas....but none that demonstrates how we can cover the 45million people that arent covered and who pays when they arent covered and need medical care...public or private health care system...someone his paying for this....and no posts address how we control the untold billions its costing u s in illeigal immigrant healthcare.

    Cutting social security and Medicare does nothing to address what the real problems are but thats all you hear from the gop and teaparty....its like cu tting those two programs along with medicaid is our salvation

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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    Quote Originally Posted by atrasicarius View Post
    As I said, it's hard to define. Yes, it's preventative care. No, it's not elective surgery and procedures. Basically, you have a certain amount of money to spend on health care. Someone's going to have to make a system for determining who gets what treatments based on the cost, the severity of the condition, how old the patient is, how common the condition is, and so on. Enough is basically the best we can reasonably do at any given time.
    So when we're economically in the toilet, we do less than we can when we're economically flush?
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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    No, we shouldn't allow the uninsured to die. I support universal healthcare, but I also don't believe that Paul or any of the Republicans want the poor/uninsured to be denied life saving medical care.
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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    Quote Originally Posted by atrasicarius View Post
    Alright, I will make that argument. Because, see, we live in this thing called a society, and sometimes it's beneficial to everyone for all the members of a society to pitch in for the common good. Because, see, the common good includes you.
    -That's- your justification for involutary servitude?

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    Re: Should We Allow The Uninsured To Die?

    While I'm quite conservative on social issues and I believe it's good to work hard to earn your bread, I don't think it's good to let people die from not having insurance. With a bad knee and the inability to find a job in a harsh economy, why should that man have to die? Not having insurance does not necessarily mean that person is lazy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by atrasicarius View Post
    You guys always talk about how easy it is to raise taxes on someone else. I guess it's equally easy to let someone else's kid die.
    When you write policy based on the mental image of your child dying, it's not going to be a cost-effective policy.

    Wanna know why? Because watching children die makes people extremely emotional and not always rational.

    In other words, the left's appeals to pity do not strengthen their arguments, they weaken them.

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