View Poll Results: Should the woman's choice dictate that the man has to pay child support?

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  • Should the woman be responsible for her own choice to not abort?

    16 37.21%
  • Should the man be forced to pay child support due to the choice of the woman?

    14 32.56%
  • Other option?

    13 30.23%
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Thread: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

  1. #121
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    I have no idea what you are talking about.
    I never said anything of the sort LOL
    Please though feel free to ASK me a questions instead of guessing and assuming WRONG you might get more accomplished LMAO
    Sigh. Do people not realize that cut and paste exists, and it's quite easy to show you what you said...

    The man should have the option to not claim the child in the same time frame as the abortion time frame. He then gives up all parental rights and is not financially responsible.
    "IF" the woman chooses she may also give up her rights to the child if she thinks she can actually carry the child and give it to the father if thats what he and she wants.
    The bolded parts point out the hypocritical asymmetry of this statements. In the first you are saying that the man should be able to act unilaterally and stick the woman with 100% of the cost of raising a child. In the second part you are saying that the woman should have to obtain the man's permission to do the same to him.

    ...and in neither case is the child consulted about whether he'd like to have one of his parents financially abandon him.
    Last edited by Kandahar; 09-08-11 at 01:39 PM.
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  2. #122
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Sigh. Do people not realize that cut and paste exists, and it's quite easy to show you what you said...





    The bolded parts point out the hypocritical asymmetry of this statements. In the first you are saying that the man should be able to act unilaterally and stick the woman with 100% of the cost of raising a child. In the second part you are saying that the woman should have to obtain the man's permission to do the same to him.
    100% WRONG

    in the first case the women can abort and should have 0% of the cost or it would be HER CHOICE to have 100%

    in the second case the man only has 100% of the cost if SHE agrees to have the child and give it up LMAO

    hahahahahahahahahahahaha

    talk about cut and paste I think you cut and paste certain words out of a sentences and ignore that rest

    sorry in reality what you said is 100% WRONG, like I said
    I said NOTHING of the sort of what you falsely implied.

    are you always this dishonest or you just have trouble understanding reality from point A to point Z
    Last edited by AGENT J; 09-08-11 at 01:42 PM.
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  3. #123
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    we are talkin about responsibility and "the child" which YOU bring up so often LMAO

    YOU brought up the child countless times, could you be anymore dishonest.

    No its not all about money when talking about responsibility and the child and fairness



    The issues here are whats fair and trying to make things equal, others have brought up responsibility and the child. SOrry money is just ONE of the issues LMAO

    Try again, this time based on REALITY LMAO
    The poll question specifically relates to child support. If you want to talk about whether the state should mandate that fathers play ball with their kids on Fridays, start a different thread. I'm going to stick to the subject at hand.
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  4. #124
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    The poll question specifically relates to child support. If you want to talk about whether the state should mandate that fathers play ball with their kids on Fridays, start a different thread. I'm going to stick to the subject at hand.
    More dishonesty, "play ball" more babbling from you and deflecting because you know you are wrong

    like I said the thread is about FAIRNESS and EQUALITY

    would you like me to ask the OP if its only about money to further prove you wrong?

    and also remind me again who talked about fairness, responsibility or the child in posts 19, 55, 80, 107 and 109?

    thats right YOU hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
    tell me that cool line about copy and past again and seeing what people posted????

    the subject at hand is fairness and equality, money is only PART of it and the OP agrees with me.
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  5. #125
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    More dishonesty, "play ball" more babbling from you and deflecting because you know you are wrong

    like I said the thread is about FAIRNESS and EQUALITY

    would you like me to ask the OP if its only about money to further prove you wrong?

    and also remind me again who talked about fairness, responsibility or the child in posts 19, 55, 80, 107 and 109?

    thats right YOU hahahahahahahahahahahahaha
    tell me that cool line about copy and past again and seeing what people posted????

    the subject at hand is fairness and equality, money is only PART of it and the OP agrees with me.
    Well I'm going to continue talking about child support (i.e. money), because the state has a limited ability to compel the parents to do anything more than that. If you want to talk about something other than the question that was asked, have fun.
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  6. #126
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Well I'm going to continue talking about child support (i.e. money), because the state has a limited ability to compel the parents to do anything more than that. If you want to talk about something other than the question that was asked, have fun.
    translation: your going to run and deflect because you know you were wrong. I get it.

    I accept your concession.
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  7. #127
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    This question starts from the wrong place.

    Child support is not about a battle of the sexes. It's not about seeing that justice is done to the mother or the father. It's about the child.

    Further, who pays child support is not determined by gender.

    Likewise, abortion is not a gender issue. All men that want to have an abortion and can find a doctor that is willing to perform the procedure should be free to "abort" too.

    Abortion affects women differently than men due to biological differences, not political ones.

  8. #128
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by RStringfield View Post
    This question starts from the wrong place.

    Child support is not about a battle of the sexes. It's not about seeing that justice is done to the mother or the father. It's about the child.

    Further, who pays child support is not determined by gender.

    Likewise, abortion is not a gender issue. All men that want to have an abortion and can find a doctor that is willing to perform the procedure should be free to "abort" too.

    Abortion affects women differently than men due to biological differences, not political ones.
    this was brought up already and addressed.
    In reality the child isnt effected by forced "child support" so that debate is pointless

    the other argument about men getting an abortion if a doctor will do it is just dishonest and nonsense.

    Also just to be clear I dont think anybody in the thread wants the man to be able to FORCE the women to give birth, not saying you said that just making that clear.
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  9. #129
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Watching you ignore the fact that a man disavowing responsibility (which would result in a 0-100 split in child support payments) is not the same as a woman having an abortion (which would result in a 0-0 split in child support payments) is comical. Abortion makes them both BETTER off financially; disavowing responsibility makes the deadbeat dad better off and the mother worse off. Oh, and in the latter scenario there's a kid who is worse off than if both parents supported him.



    I already posted these basic mathematical facts, and rather than respond to it you said "zomg emotion." Here it is again for your convenience. An economic example of how these decisions would actually play out. Assuming equal incomes and a 50-50 split in child support for simplicity, but the numbers can be adjusted and the point still stands.

    Woman chooses to have an abortion: Man pays 0%, woman pays 0% (of the cost of raising the child to adulthood)
    Woman chooses not to have an abortion: Man pays 50%, woman pays 50%

    Man chooses to disavow responsibility: Man pays 0%, woman pays 100%
    Man chooses to take responsibility: Man pays 50%, woman pays 50%

    Of these four decisions, only the one you are advocating results in an unequal distribution in the burden of child support. In other words, the man is able to burden the woman with his share, but the woman is not able to do the same to him. Abortion is not the same as what you are advocating, and to call these laws "sexist" for keeping the burden on BOTH parents is bull****, when you are advocating an unequal distribution in child support costs in the man's favor (for parents in equal financial situations).

    And again there is an actual CHILD who is harmed if a parent unilaterally disavows financial responsibility for it. That isn't the case if the mother unilaterally decides to have an abortion; there is no child who needs child support then.
    Post this over and over if you like, what you literally don't seem to be able to comprehend is her choice. I agree with pretty much everything that you are saying, another thing that you don't get. The point is that it is IRRELEVANT. Why? Her choice determines, or is the foundation of, all end results. I have already explained this, so go back and read it again if you think that it will help you. If not, don't. Either way debating you further is a waste of time since you can't grasp this basic fact.

    Her choice to use birth control means that there is no need for child support. It is all, literally, about her choice. Support for the child can come from areas other than the father, adoption, the mother, grandparents... all that matters is that the child is supported. If it can't be, then she should make the responsible choice and abort. If she chooses to not do this, then that is her choice.
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  10. #130
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    Re: Should Woman's Choice Trump the Man's??

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post

    Her choice to use birth control means that there is no need for child support. It is all, literally, about her choice. Support for the child can come from areas other than the father, adoption, the mother, grandparents... all that matters is that the child is supported. If it can't be, then she should make the responsible choice and abort. If she chooses to not do this, then that is her choice.
    Are you really suggesting that if a woman can't afford a child without the father's financial support, she should have an abortion or give her baby up for adoption?
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