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Thread: Child Support Payments

  1. #361
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    He made that decision when he ****ed the woman. That was his decision alone. No one forced him into it, and, unlike with the woman, he has no physical consequences that result from it. That is why an abortion is the decision of the woman.
    Woman made that decision when she opened her legs. THat was her decision alone. No one forced her into it.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  2. #362
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    No, I think is that is wrong to bring child into the world without responsible parents to properly care for it.
    I do not buy, and probably will not buy (less someone gives a very convincing argument) the "better dead than poor" argument.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  3. #363
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    If a woman chooses to keep her pregnancy and have a child against the man's wishes and she chooses to not use her legal option of birth control and have an abortion, should the man have to pay child suport for her choice. Should the man have to pay Child Support if he does not want the child and the woman decides to not opt to have an abortion as a means of contraception?

    I think that he should not be legally liable if he does not want the child.

    The woman has all the choice and can not only keep the baby and make him pay, but she can keep the baby, not tell him about the baby and then hit him up 18 years later for back Child Support.This thread is not about a woman's right to choose. That is legal and fine and all that.

    This thread is about a woman's choice subjegating a man to the role of a wallet for 18 years due to the whim of a woman's choice to keep a child against his wishes. Before we hear the whole, he shoulda kept it in his pants and now he has no choice in the matter.

    That is understood. That is the law. The issue is, is the law fair?

    As far as I am aware, there is no case law that deals with him being forced due to her choice. There is law about her having a choice, but none about why he should have to pay for her choice. That being said, this thread is not about the law, but about what is right. This is also not about exceptions: ie, she found out 5 months into her pregnancy due to irregular cycles, etc.

    This is about the woman that gets pregnant when the man wants to leave the marriage, or the woman that pricks the condom when having sex with a guy that she just met so that she gets pregnant and wants nothing to do with him or the times that a one-nighter turns into an 18 year nightmare simply because she wanted the child more and the state backs her decision out of sexism.Are women not responsible?

    Can she not be held liable for her own decisions?If she wants the baby, that is fine. She should have the baby and the man should be able to be out of the picture, should he so choose. If she doesn not want to raise the child on her own with no support, then she should abort.

    Easy as that. That is her right. That is the law.

    Hopefull I have explained all of this well enough. Yes, this is about abortion and threads like this exist in the Abortion Forum, but this is also a poll. I would like to know what people think outside the abortion debating crowd.Be nice please and just stick to the poll.

    If tangents occur please make a thread in the Abortion Forum as would be appropriate.

    Thanks...
    And a man can do all those things to woman, a man can prick a condom, a man can rape her, refuse to pull out, slip the condom off, etc. and many times people (both men and women) view a baby/pregnancy as a way to keep their partner and prevent a breakup/divorce. That's why I am pro choice. If a woman is in an abusive situation, and wants to leave, sometimes having an abortion permits her to leave and escape her abuser. A man isn't entirely powerless. A man, even if he is a rapist/abuser, can fight for custody rights to their child. And no, I don't see any problem with a man annulling his parental rights. Nobody should have a baby as a way to control their partner, or manipulate their sexual relationship to cause a pregnancy. Somebody having a child should not feel trapped or punished, nor should children viewed as consequences.

    If you think forcing a man to pay child support after a woman pricks his condom is wrong, then you can relate to the way a woman feels when she is being forced to gestate a child that she didn't want to conceive in the first place.

  4. #364
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Quite a bit of improvement. Though pregnancy is still different than influenza or the mumps.
    And influenza is different from mumps, and mumps is different from measles. Yeah, many times people are delighted to contract pregnancy, but still....

    Pregnancy is the creation of additional human life and the normal way by which our species reproduces. It's not disease, it's result of choice.
    Pregnancy is the PROCESS of creation. It's the ONLY way our species reproduces, that still doesn't mean a woman is obligated to do it. Pregnancy isn't always the result of choice. Thanks once again to medical science, choosing to have sex doesn't mean choosing pregnancy. The fact that medical science hasn't yet perfected that process doesn't mean it's not valid.


    We've come a long way in making pregnancies safer, but the way in which it is initiated has not changed. It's not just the woman's body at that point which requires consideration, but also the life of the human created through her choice.
    Pregnancy can also be initiated by medical science. Because the life of the "human created through her choice", or non-choice as the case may be, will not come to fruition without the woman's body, it is her consideration whether to donate the use of her body.
    "Though no one can go back and make a brand new start, anyone can start from now and make a brand new ending."
    ~Anonymous

  5. #365
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Maybe he did wear a rubber…
    Maybe it failed…
    Maybe she pricked a hole in it…
    Maybe they were in a relationship and he trusted her and she lied about her birth control…

    There are any number of ways that this can happen. I know that the most fun method is to discredit the man. That damn dead beat! Those poor women! Look dude, you have fallen into the trap. Get out fast…
    If you're going to use arguments like that to show how unjust it is to force a man to pay child support, then you should support a woman's right to choose as well as the man's.

    Maybe she used birth control...
    Maybe it failed...
    Maybe he pricked a hole in the condom...
    Maybe he lied to her about being sterilized...

    It's totally out of hand for you to relate to a man on that level and take his side, but not a woman's... If it's so wrong to force a man in that situation, then it should be equally wrong to force a woman to carry the baby in that situation.

  6. #366
    I'm kind of a big deal

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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    HAHA! Let us examine. You're original comment



    My original response



    Hmmm....games I played? No no no. Quit lying and at least be honest in debate. Not that I was playing, what YOU were playing. See you now claim you said "Some people have abortions because they feel its in the childs best welfare to do so". Now, note your ORIGINAL statement. It's not the same thing. Word games by me? Please. I think you were just hoping I wasn't going to go back and check up. See what you say in your original statement is that MANY think about the welfare of the child and make a response. Not that they think they're doing what's best in the child's interest. You said I can disagree, and I said I do disagree because killing a child is NOT looking out for a child's best interest.

    It seems that it is YOU who are changing their tune and trying to make it sound like you said something different from the start. My original comment and all those which followed up stand. I DO NOT believe they do think about the welfare of the child because death is the end of welfare. Welfare only applies to the living. That statement is still very true, as is my original response to your post and all subsequent posts. Now, quit trying to change what you said and just fess up and be a man about it. People make mistakes in arguments all the time, it's ok. You messed up here, but I'm sure you will be well more dutiful in your arguments in the future.
    only gaming being played is you are trying to TELL me what I YOU think I meant instead of what I actually said LMAO are you serious or just Fing with me??????

    Im glad you quoted me because its further proof of what I said and its till 100% true, why are trying to deny that and play the game further?

    yes or no. are you denying my original statement means some people abort because they think that's that in the child's best welfare? thats what I said and it is true. PERIOD

    you disagree with that BUT that doesnt change the fact thats why they do it.

    nobody changed anything? This is NOT an insult or even an attempt its a SERIOUS question. Is english your fist language?

    I changed NOTHING from my original statements and it is 100% true.
    You disagree death is better welfare and thats your opinion and nothing more

    you also disagree thats why anybody does it and you are 100% WRONG on that one because they do.

    I made no mistake, did nothing of the sort and my original statement above stands nor did I change it in anyway what so ever, at this point im starting to think you are just trolling on this topic with me? You almost have to be to assume and make up so much.
    Last edited by AGENT J; 09-06-11 at 12:21 AM.
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  7. #367
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Mathematician View Post
    If the woman is going to use the argument "my body, my choice" then the man should reply "your body, your responsibility".

    Personally, I disagree with it being solely her choice. I feel that if the father wants the child then she should be obligated to give birth.
    The sexism in your post is obvious. You want the men to get what they want in either situation. He abortions is paternal rights and he can force her to carry. Thank god women are treated equally in this country now. I refuse to be any ****ing man's broodmare.

  8. #368
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by OKgrannie View Post
    And influenza is different from mumps, and mumps is different from measles. Yeah, many times people are delighted to contract pregnancy, but still....
    To certain degrees yes. But reproduction is not the same as invasive disease. That's just biological fact. Rally against it if you want, curse evolution if need be; but what is is.

    Quote Originally Posted by OKgrannie View Post
    Pregnancy is the PROCESS of creation. It's the ONLY way our species reproduces, that still doesn't mean a woman is obligated to do it. Pregnancy isn't always the result of choice. Thanks once again to medical science, choosing to have sex doesn't mean choosing pregnancy. The fact that medical science hasn't yet perfected that process doesn't mean it's not valid.
    Well, it depends. Science never said that it could make probabilities zero. Never. To assume so is to be a fool. We can make the probabilities VERY low; but short of abstinence or certain forms of sterilization there's no 100% way to stop it. You're not going to make it zero with a piece of plastic or a pill. Reduce, yes; eliminate, no. Choosing to have sex DOES mean choosing the possibility of becoming pregnant. It would be stupid to say otherwise.


    Quote Originally Posted by OKgrannie View Post
    Pregnancy can also be initiated by medical science. Because the life of the "human created through her choice", or non-choice as the case may be, will not come to fruition without the woman's body, it is her consideration whether to donate the use of her body.
    Barring cases of rape, it is ALWAYS a choice.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  9. #369
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    only gaming being played is you are trying to TELL me what I YOU think I meant instead of what I actually said LMAO are you serious or just Fing with me??????

    Im glad you quoted me because its further proof of what I said and its till 100% true, why are trying to deny that and play the game further?

    yes or no. are you denying my original statement means some people abort because they think that's that in the child's best welfare? thats what I said and it is true. PERIOD

    you disagree with that BUT that doesnt change the fact thats why they do it.

    nobody changed anything? This is NOT an insult or even an attempt its a SERIOUS question. Is english your fist language?

    I changed NOTHING from my original statements and it is 100% true.
    You disagree death is better welfare and thats your opinion and nothing more

    you also disagree thats why anybody does it and you are 100% WRONG on that one because they do.

    I made no mistake, did nothing of the sort and my original statement above stands nor did I change it in anyway what so ever, at this point im starting to think you are just trolling on this topic with me?
    Plenty of mistake. I can't believe you're still trying to argue against it. The fact that you have nothing to back up but attempted ridicule marks that you have no argument. What you said at the end and what you said at the beginning are not the same thing. Sorry.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  10. #370
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    Re: Child Support Payments

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    And immunity from the consequences of biology.
    Women and young girl's shouldn't be slaves to their biology.

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