View Poll Results: Why is the middle class the most crippled by income tax? Select all that apply

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  • Allowing many people to have a shot at being uber-wealthy is dangerous

    1 1.19%
  • Making the uber-wealthy share the load would be bad for the economy

    0 0%
  • The middle class do not have as much of an influence on politics as the wealthy do

    30 35.71%
  • The idea that the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax is a myth

    54 64.29%
  • A few wealthy, a few more middle class and many lower class citizens is best

    3 3.57%
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Thread: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

  1. #61
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer
    How many times do I need to explain it! Read some previous posts before you jump in .. please!!! Its not about total amount paid ... its about the relative crippling effect it has on those paying it. Its about the ratio of living expenses to taxes paid.
    And it ultimately boils down to you wanting to punish success. God forbid the concept of a man determining on his own what he should spend his money on.

    I don't give a good hot damn about what you think is "crippling". The fact is that your argument is ultimately based on jealousy. When you make the money, you can determine how much you want to have it taxed or given to government. Don't expect the rich to float you along.

    I just get really sick and tired about people who complain about having nothing when they are the chief factor in why that is so.

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    How many times do I need to explain it! Read some previous posts before you jump in .. please!!! Its not about total amount paid ... its about the relative crippling effect it has on those paying it. Its about the ratio of living expenses to taxes paid.
    Again, you're flat out ignoring the fact that the system doesn't work like you say it does in those ridiculous little analogies you're posting. Those "crippling" taxes don't exist at the income levels you keep citing. You've provided absolutely no legitimate evidence of your hyperbolic claims and you keep running through this thread acting like you're making some profound revelation. You're wrong. Period. Accept that, read a few articles...or better yet, go look at a few websites (IRS, BOL, etc) and do some research so you'll actually understand what you're talking about. Somebody at or near poverty will not be paying "crippling taxes".

    If you made a legitimate argument based on legitmate numbers and included legitimate information from the current system, you might have a leg to stand on. As it is, you made a dummy argument purely to suit your unfounded claims and refuse to accept reality. You can mock the points other people make all day, but until you use facts to make yours they're just as foolish as anything you find disagreeable (if not more).
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    How many times do I need to explain it! Read some previous posts before you jump in .. please!!! Its not about total amount paid ... its about the relative crippling effect it has on those paying it. Its about the ratio of living expenses to taxes paid.
    Ok, so please don't be so touchy. Maybe you should have just said your tired of the middle class paying at the rate they do on federal income tax.
    Here is the thing. If you want less taxes, expect the govt to spend less. I was mearly pointing out that the "rich" pay quite a large percentage of federal income tax. I have also pointed out their is a large sector that pays nothing in federal income tax. I can think of quite of few areas that can/could be cut back that the Congress spends money on.

    Heck, I can't itemize and guess fall into the middle class income bracket. Would I like to pay less, you bet. Yet I know that unless federal spending is reduced, paying less is not realistic. Hopefully the economy will pick back up down the road and generate more income for the feds. Even when that happens, Congress really needs to reduced wastefull spending and reform a lot of programs.
    Last edited by mike2810; 08-23-11 at 11:51 AM.
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    ts not about total amount paid ... its about the relative crippling effect it has on those paying it. Its about the ratio of living expenses to taxes paid.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    And it ultimately boils down to you wanting to punish success.
    You have a real reading comprehension problem to interpret MA's comment about the ratio of living expenses to taxes paid as wanting to punish success.

    Or is it you cannot reason out that it is harder for someone that pays higher portion of their living wage on taxes then it is for someone who is not struggling to pay living expenses?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    And it ultimately boils down to you wanting to punish success.
    Ha! Straw man

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    God forbid the concept of a man determining on his own what he should spend his money on.
    what are you talking about? I have never suggested anything that would go against this

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    I don't give a good hot damn about what you think is "crippling".
    Unfortunately, by definition, what I showed exactly that with a flat tax, the tax burden on the poor would be much more painful than the tax burden on the wealthy; there's no way to get around that fact

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    The fact is that your argument is ultimately based on jealousy.
    There's the ol straw man again

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    When you make the money, you can determine how much you want to have it taxed or given to government. Don't expect the rich to float you along.
    Unfortunately, when it comes to taxes, everyone has to compromise on what they pay for, its the only workable way

    Quote Originally Posted by Gipper View Post
    I just get really sick and tired about people who complain about having nothing when they are the chief factor in why that is so.
    This may be true for some people, but not for all. For you to make such a generalized statement is mighty presumptuous. Many of us who pay taxes (and many that don't) believe that a governmental system that allows people to live through governmental assistance, while still encouraging/rewarding them to do better, is the most humane while still economically sound system. Unfortunately, our current system encourages people to stay on welfare due to abrupt welfare cutoff income levels.

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Again, you're flat out ignoring the fact that the system doesn't work like you say it does in those ridiculous little analogies you're posting. Those "crippling" taxes don't exist at the income levels you keep citing. You've provided absolutely no legitimate evidence of your hyperbolic claims and you keep running through this thread acting like you're making some profound revelation. You're wrong. Period. Accept that, read a few articles...or better yet, go look at a few websites (IRS, BOL, etc) and do some research so you'll actually understand what you're talking about. Somebody at or near poverty will not be paying "crippling taxes".
    If you made a legitimate argument based on legitmate numbers and included legitimate information from the current system, you might have a leg to stand on. As it is, you made a dummy argument purely to suit your unfounded claims and refuse to accept reality. You can mock the points other people make all day, but until you use facts to make yours they're just as foolish as anything you find disagreeable (if not more).[/QUOTE]

    Again you continue to not pay attention to what I am saying. I am well aware that we currently do not have a flat tax and that we have welfare safety nets. However, people have been arguing that a flat tax is the thing to do and I responded with that example explaining how it is not the right thing to do. Are we on the same page now? Read back if you want, its all there.

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    Ok, so please don't be so touchy. Maybe you should have just said your tired of the middle class paying at the rate they do on federal income tax.
    Here is the thing. If you want less taxes, expect the govt to spend less. I was mearly pointing out that the "rich" pay quite a large percentage of federal income tax. I have also pointed out their is a large sector that pays nothing in federal income tax. I can think of quite of few areas that can/could be cut back that the Congress spends money on.
    Government spending cuts would not be sufficient to reduce the deficit (although I agree that some are needed), simply increasing the tax rate by a few percentages on the most wealthy would be significant and the wealthy would not even feel it. Most righty's are just arguing over an irrelevant and pointless principle that is unethical in nature.

    Quote Originally Posted by mike2810 View Post
    Heck, I can't itemize and guess fall into the middle class income bracket. Would I like to pay less, you bet. Yet I know that unless federal spending is reduced, paying less is not realistic. Hopefully the economy will pick back up down the road and generate more income for the feds. Even when that happens, Congress really needs to reduced wasteful spending and reform a lot of programs.
    Don't let the republican propaganda fool you; its a dirty trick that plays on people's inability to understand certain economic realities

  8. #68
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Government spending cuts would not be sufficient to reduce the deficit (although I agree that some are needed), simply increasing the tax rate by a few percentages on the most wealthy would be significant and the wealthy would not even feel it. Most righty's are just arguing over an irrelevant and pointless principle that is unethical in nature.



    Don't let the republican propaganda fool you; its a dirty trick that plays on people's inability to understand certain economic realities
    why do you keep pretending you can speak for those you want to soak with more taxes? you assume that those you wish to punish have the same spending patterns as you do. You are just making stuff up.

    and you miss a key point. we are in the mess we are in because too many people expect too much government that they don't pay for.



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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    why do you keep pretending you can speak for those you want to soak with more taxes? you assume that those you wish to punish have the same spending patterns as you do. You are just making stuff up.

    and you miss a key point. we are in the mess we are in because too many people expect too much government that they don't pay for.
    Frivolous lawsuits, lawyers milking and draining the country dry out of greed...same with corporations and thier lawyers working tirelessly for HUGE fees to assure GE doesnt pay a dime in taxs and of course the lawyer politicans that protect the American Bar Association from tort reform...that would save the country billions.
    WHen you get LAWYERS like now Indicted John Edwards who is just one of thousands Malpractice lawyers amassed 150,000,000 suing doctors which in turn COSTS all americans who have to pay for it....bankruptcy lawyers who hawk on tv ads come to me ill make you DEBT free the rest of america can pay for you and me.
    Thats whats milking the country NOT THE POOR...not the people that YOU dont even want to have a minimum wage protection...its the RICH that milk the country and always have been.....you say the same thing over and over ad nauseum I guess you hope and pray one day someone, anyone will believe you...lol...wont be me

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Government spending cuts would not be sufficient to reduce the deficit (although I agree that some are needed), simply increasing the tax rate by a few percentages on the most wealthy would be significant and the wealthy would not even feel it. Most righty's are just arguing over an irrelevant and pointless principle that is unethical in nature.



    Don't let the republican propaganda fool you; its a dirty trick that plays on people's inability to understand certain economic realities
    Please provide creditable links to back up your claims.
    "I can explain it to you but, I can't understand it for you"

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