View Poll Results: Why is the middle class the most crippled by income tax? Select all that apply

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  • Allowing many people to have a shot at being uber-wealthy is dangerous

    1 1.19%
  • Making the uber-wealthy share the load would be bad for the economy

    0 0%
  • The middle class do not have as much of an influence on politics as the wealthy do

    30 35.71%
  • The idea that the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax is a myth

    54 64.29%
  • A few wealthy, a few more middle class and many lower class citizens is best

    3 3.57%
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Thread: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

  1. #301
    warrior of the wetlands
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by David D. View Post
    Too simple Turtle. There are those who are lazy leeches, but there are also those who are trying and just do not have the skills to make more than minimum wage.
    fair enough=we just need to provide some serious dis-incentives for them to keep voting for more government and costing others more and more tax hikes



  2. #302
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Uh no it will have the exact same impact.....20%.

    We shouldn't be taxing income at all in the first place....we should be taxing consumption. I don't know any poor people buying capitol assets for a business, buying private aircraft and taking lavish vacations.

    It would seem to me that a poor person is using most of their income to exist, while a rich person is using more of their income for investments and pleasure. 20% of 100 is more than 20% of 10.

    If a poor person wants to improve their situation, taxing income means their savings, 401K, retirement, roth ira, etc, will no be touched; and when withdrawn, that person who worked for their retirement will not be charged just for breathing. They will be charged based on what they buy, and therefore have control.
    I would think that type of system would make sense, so long that we also make sure that the 'essentials' like food, utilities, and other basic commodities maintain the lowest tax rates, whilst the luxuries & excesses a bit higher.

    Could imagine what type of a business/gov battle this would set off though, arguing that their product deserves a lower tax rate because.....
    Last edited by David D.; 08-27-11 at 12:21 AM.

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    fair enough=we just need to provide some serious dis-incentives for them to keep voting for more government and costing others more and more tax hikes
    Definitely.

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by David D. View Post
    Taking 20% of a poor person's income will have a much more significant impact than taking 20% of a rich person's income. And sure, the poor person will receive maybe like 10% back in government aid but then what's the point. Why not just cut out all the middle-man and tax them 10% in the first place?
    Right back at ya: the rich person is taxed 20%, yet will receive 0% back in government aid. Why not just cut out all the middle-man and tax them 0% in the first place?

    The answer, of course, is because social welfare programs are not the government's only expense.

    Quote Originally Posted by David D. View Post
    You spend 100% of your monthly income on the essentials (food, shelter, clothing) and someone takes 20% of that, it will have a far greater impact than if you spend 30-40% on those same essentials and have the rest to spend/save on other things.
    Ahh, so the poor get 30-40% to go blow, but the rich are evil when they reinvest in their company...where your poor person works...mhmm...

  5. #305
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    fair enough=we just need to provide some serious dis-incentives for them to keep voting for more government and costing others more and more tax hikes
    That is where political campaigns come in. Educate the voter to your point of view. That is how it is done. You do not eliminate voters because they do not agree with you.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  6. #306
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    That is where political campaigns come in. Educate the voter to your point of view. That is how it is done. You do not eliminate voters because they do not agree with you.
    pain tends to be the best education for the ignorant.



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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Right back at ya: the rich person is taxed 20%, yet will receive 0% back in government aid. Why not just cut out all the middle-man and tax them 0% in the first place?

    The answer, of course, is because social welfare programs are not the government's only expense
    This was my point, poor pay 10% to support those other government functions, rich pay 20% - 10% to poor and 10% to government functions.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Ahh, so the poor get 30-40% to go blow, but the rich are evil when they reinvest in their company...where your poor person works...mhmm
    Bit lost here, could you restate?

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by David D. View Post
    I would think that type of system would make sense, so long that we also make sure that the 'essentials' like food, utilities, and other basic commodities maintain the lowest tax rates, whilst the luxuries & excesses a bit higher.

    Could imagine what type of a business/gov battle this would set off though, arguing that their product deserves a lower tax rate because.....
    Negative.

    20%. Everything.

    No exceptions. No exemptions. No sin-tax (tobacco). No write-offs.

    It doesn't matter if you're buying a loaf of bread or new Jaguar: 20%. It doesn't matter if you use a lot of water because you have a medical condition and take baths (essential), or you just enjoy a long hot shower (luxury): 20%.

    It doesn't matter if your business *needs* a new piece of equipment, or if you just want to upgrade because you had a good year: 20%.

    It doesn't matter if you have a high electrical and internet bill because your taking online collage classes (essential), or your debate online at all times of day and night (luxury): 20%.
    Last edited by Jerry; 08-27-11 at 12:38 AM.

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    pain tends to be the best education for the ignorant.
    .....I swear I heard something like that come out of a Drill Sergeant last year....

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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Negative.

    20%. Everything.

    No exceptions. No exemptions. No sin-tax (tobacco). No write-offs.

    It doesn't matter if you're buying a loaf of bread or new Jaguar: 20%.
    I don't think this would work. I don't think anyone would actually go along with a 20% sales tax on food. It's too much - people'd be revolting in the streets. You need to treat the essentials and the luxuries differently...

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