View Poll Results: Why is the middle class the most crippled by income tax? Select all that apply

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  • Allowing many people to have a shot at being uber-wealthy is dangerous

    1 1.19%
  • Making the uber-wealthy share the load would be bad for the economy

    0 0%
  • The middle class do not have as much of an influence on politics as the wealthy do

    30 35.71%
  • The idea that the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax is a myth

    54 64.29%
  • A few wealthy, a few more middle class and many lower class citizens is best

    3 3.57%
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Thread: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

  1. #121
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    An Immoral Tax - WSJ.com
    We are so habituated to the progressive income-tax that most conservatives, fiddling at the margins, fail to focus their ire on the basic immorality of that progressive income-tax, and the social damage it has caused.
    For decades, progressive economists have tried to make what one called "the uneasy case for the progressive income tax" -- without success. That is why the debate about President Bush's tax reforms does not go nearly deep enough. The problem is the progressive income tax itself, and how it has become a cornerstone of the punish-the-rich mentality of the Democratic Party.

    http://www.hoover.org/publications/p.../article/72291

    the second article has a rather sound destruction of the "benefits" argument for progressive income taxes
    First, the basic premise of the protection theory is flawed. Government protections extend to much more than property. The Founding Fathers made clear their vision for America in the Declaration of Independence when they spoke of the “unalienable rights” of all Americans to “life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” There is no basis for believing that a low-income person’s life is worth more or less to an individual (as contrasted with an insurance actuary, an economist, or a jury assessing damages in a wrongful death case) than the life of a high-income person. The same is true for liberty and the pursuit of happiness. The American military and other protective agencies and institutions of government exist to protect and preserve these rights for all Americans equally, regardless of how rich or poor they are.
    Progressive taxation is a lawful amendment to the U.S. Constitution, so what some of the Founding Fathers might have thought about it is immaterial.

    Progressive taxation only exists because the wealthy have too much money relative to other income brackets. If you the wealthy want it to go away, they need to start making those jobs, raising to salaries, and signing out those bonuses.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 08-23-11 at 11:38 PM.
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  2. #122
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    Of course you would reject anything that didn't coddle you
    that makes no sense-or I should say even less sense.

    I don't want more government. You do. I don't need more government because I am neither dependent nor parasitic.



  3. #123
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    Progressive taxation is a lawful amendment to the U.S. Constitution, so what some of the Founding Fathers might have thought about it is immaterial.
    glad to see you are such a statist. tell me what does the 16th Amendment actually say

    you do understand--and I am extending a lot of credit here-that whether its constitutional or not is not of interest when discussing whether the PIT is sound or not



  4. #124
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    glad to see you are such a statist. tell me what does the 16th Amendment actually say

    you do understand--and I am extending a lot of credit here-that whether its constitutional or not is not of interest when discussing whether the PIT is sound or not
    I edited my post:

    Progressive taxation only exists because the wealthy have too much money relative to other income brackets. If you the wealthy want it to go away, they need to start making those jobs, raising to salaries, and signing out those bonuses. Then the tax code can be reformed.
    If you notice something good in yourself, give credit to God, not to yourself, but be certain the evil you commit is always your own and yours to acknowledge.

    St. Benedict

  5. #125
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    I edited my post:

    Progressive taxation only exists because the wealthy have too much money relative to other income brackets. If you the wealthy want it to go away, they need to start making those jobs, raising to salaries, and signing out those bonuses. Then the tax code can be reformed.
    wrong

    progressive income tax is a politically sound strategy

    it allows politicians to buy the votes of the many with the wealth of a minority voting bloc.


    it also gave congress a ton of power.

    so your claim is without any rational basis



  6. #126
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    you are being dishonest now.

    the bottom 50% make about 12.5% of the income

    they sure use far more than 12,5% of the government services.

    uh how has the government coddled me? I pay far more than I use.

    and where does the nonsense that if you cannot afford something you should be able to get it without paying for it come from?
    This is what I found .. let me know if you find something substantially different:

    Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?-wealth-distribution-jpg

    Lee Gaddies: Wealth inequality as it stands today welcome to the new gilded age.

    That's the 2.5% I was talking about
    Last edited by MusicAdventurer; 08-23-11 at 11:52 PM.

  7. #127
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    that makes no sense-or I should say even less sense.

    I don't want more government. You do. I don't need more government because I am neither dependent nor parasitic.
    If it weren't for our government, we wouldn't enjoy the wealth we do, simple

  8. #128
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    This is what I found .. let me know if you find something substantially different:

    Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?-wealth-distribution-jpg

    Lee Gaddies: Wealth inequality as it stands today welcome to the new gilded age.

    That's the 2.5% I was talking about
    you seem to think that I find income inequality to be a problem. I don't. many of those who are "poor" are poor due to their own poor choices



  9. #129
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    If it weren't for our government, we wouldn't enjoy the wealth we do, simple
    ok so what--that is not an argument that one percent should pay 40% of the income taxes and 47% pay nothing

    everyone benefits about the same from government. everyone ought to pay about the same for that benefit. Now I realize many cannot, but that does not cut against the fact that they SHOULD



  10. #130
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    Re: Why does the middle class pay the most crippling amount of income tax?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    wrong

    progressive income tax is a politically sound strategy

    it allows politicians to buy the votes of the many with the wealth of a minority voting bloc.


    it also gave congress a ton of power.

    so your claim is without any rational basis
    I will quote what others have said before me that verify my point:

    "It is a natural process for the wealthiest individuals and firms in a society to become disproportionately wealthier over time. In order to prevent the political instability resulting from the natural stratification of the populace into an ever smaller and wealthier aristocracy or moneyed class, and an ever larger working class, all free market democracies engage in progressive taxation and programs to enhance economic opportunity for the lower and middle classes"

    Oh .. let me guess .. you really don't want anyone to have a chance at bettering themselves do you? If you support a flat tax, you clearly do not. This has been proven time and time again .. look back at some of the examples I spelled out .. look at the above quote which is a sound argument devoid of holes .. just face it, you just want more for YOU, it doesn't seem like you care about your country or anyone else that lives in it, at least not if you maintain you position on this

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