View Poll Results: Embargo?

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  • End Embargo

    65 48.87%
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    68 51.13%
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Thread: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

  1. #71
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    debatepolitics
    Yes, I know now. That took me a minute to figure out. Also why does it take 10 minutes to reply with sentences only, not details? Are you trying to gather your information?

  2. #72
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheDemSocialist View Post

    Body:

    I. Reason 1: It has failed to remove the Castro regime, and help the Cuban people.

    A. The very purpose of the Cuban Trade Embargo was to remove Castro. This has clearly not done that. It has actually strengthened Castro and has gained more popularity from his people. According to a Time Magazine Article titled Cuba: Castro’s Brain: Castro’s popularity has grown over time and “increased with fervor.” It is common sense to see that the embargo has failed to remove Fidel’s communist regime.

    B. The Cuban embargo has hurt the Cuban people, which is the exact opposite of what the embargo was supposed to do. It is very difficult for the Cuban people to get everyday items, like batteries, beef, and aspirin. It also deprives them of important imports like medical technology for their health care system.

    II. Reason 2: It is Inhumane.

    A. It is just simply wrong for the US government to use food, and medical supply as being as a instrument of United States foreign policy. Representative of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights on the situation
    of human rights in Cuba described the effects of the embargo on the economic, social and cultural rights of the Cuban people as “disastrous”.

    B. Cuba has fallen into a “special period”, after the fall of their main trading partner the Soviet Union. With the embargo in place Cuba was left isolated.

    III. Reason 3: Condemned by the United Nations.

    A. The United Nations has condemned the US embargo against Cuba many, many times. According to El Mundo a Spanish Newspaper the United Nations has” condemned the embargo as a clear violation of international law every year since 1992. A question I ask is why does the United State hold itself above the United Nations, which is basically the world. “

    IV. Reason 4: The Embargo is Old and Outdated.

    A. According to Al Kamen author of At 50, the Cuban trade embargo is not aging well, that the embargo had wide support at the beginnings of it, but a recent poll shows that 53% of Americans would like to see the embargo lifted.

    B. The Castro regime is open to negations so logic would indicate that the US should openly deal with Cuba instead of adding the hardships to Cuba.

    V. Reason 5: Embargo Hurts Americans.

    A. According to Sen. Jeanne Kohl-Welles who wrote an article for Sound Business Journal , the embargo is hurting American farmers. In particular the embargo hurts wheat, pea, and lentil growers “by depriving them of access to Cuba’s $700 million food import market.”

    B. If we are a free nation we should have the freedom to travel. The embargo puts a strict restriction on American to travel to Cuba. It is illegal for an American citizen to travel to Cuba for whatever reason it may be. Most Americans who want to visit Cuba have to do it illegal by going through a third country such as Canada.

    VI. Reason 6: This is Not the Right Way to Reform Cuba.

    A. This is not the right way to reform Cuba. By hurting the Cuban people and oppressing the Cuban government, which is the exact same claim we are making why we hold up the embargo is because the Cuban government “oppresses the Cuban people.”
    Conclusion:

    Restate Thesis: The Cuban trade embargo should be lifted because of many reasons:
    Review Main Points: it has clearly failed to remove the Castro regime, it is inhumane; it is condemned by the UN, old and outdated, hurts Americans, and is not the right way to “reform” Cuba.

    Closer: The Cuban embargo should be immediately lifted. It is hurting the Cuban people and is making the US look like the all controlling state. We should immediately lift the embargo if we uphold our name of being a country of justice, and hope. We are destroying the Cuban nation and the Cuban people. We should look towards diplomacy instead of sanctions to try to reform the country of Cuba.
    Please note that this is not my personal opinion.



    This rationale has some flaws. Reason one is correct. The embargo has failed under its original motivations. It has been a punishment though which is what it was designed to do as well. It is a way to say "Hey we don't like you." which in this way it has been successful.

    Reason 2 is a fallacy. The embargo is not inhumane. Cuba has never been isolated. It has had the USSR and several other states have dropped the embargo over time.

    Reason 3 is silly. The UN condemns lots of things. It was a non-binding agreement. If the UN were serious the they would have done more. But the UN is not a serious place.

    Reason 4 is partially correct. The embargo is old but it is not outdated. We are still saying "Hey we don't like you." It is the right of the US to make the statement that we don't want to trade with them.

    Reason 5 is overstated. The embargo does very little to America. 700 million, although vast to you and me, is chump change to the US economy. The embargo does hurt Cuba though. Their foreign minister even said as much with the written statement when the UN condemned the embargo in 2009. But the US government is not in the business of caring what hurts Cubans in matters of trade. They are not our citizens and should have no voice in US political trade decisions. Their minister said that we have denied them up to 93 billion over the life of the embargo and that we have hindered their development. Any US representative should say "You are not the US. You have no right to the trade in the first place since we don't want to trade with you."

    Further the issue of freedom is not in question here. You do not have a right to travel wherever and wherever you want to. Drive to ORNL or any major military base and watch them turn you away unless you have a direct reason for being there. The American people, through our political decisions, have stated that travel to Cuba should be restricted. This is just like driving without a seat belt. Yes, your freedom to drive unsafely is restricted but society can restrict this through law.

    Reason 6 is a person opinion and is not an objective reason to remove the embargo. The opposite opinion is that we shouldn't trade with a person who has tried to place nuclear weapons so close to our shores. Mind you, this doesn't mean he didn't have a right to do this. It is just that we don't have to like it and our embargo is one response to not liking his actions.

    Your conclusion is flawed and your premise is not supported except by reason 1. The main rationale to keep the embargo remain.

    1. The person(s) who directly threatened the US by allowing (or at least wanting) nukes onto his land is still in power. Our response, the embargo, to that action (the embargo is a response to other actions by the Cuban government as well) should remain while the person who threatened us remains.

    2. The embargo is a political chip used in US internal politics. It doesn't harm the US but its removal de-focuses the political conversation in South Florida. Keeping this conversation going is more important now than actually removing the embargo.

    3. A signification portion of American citizens of Cuban decent still support the embargo. The rest of us should support them since the embargo doesn't hurt the US. This last one is a little bit more difficult to determine but they still seem to be voting for people who vote to keep the embargo.

    The opposing conclusion would be: Trade with Cuba is not a right the US even remotely has to recognize. If they want trade with us, then they have to do it on our terms we can agree with. Normally this type of trade wouldn't be a problem. We will practice capitalism in a heart beat. But China didn't park nukes off our coast. The dictators in the Middle East are never going to be a threaten to us legitimately. Cuba was direct threat and because they were and because of the special historical relationship and because the person who directly threatened us is still in power, the embargo should stay. The embargo shouldn't last forever. But, it should last until at least Fidel dies.

  3. #73
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    I am not as ideologically against lifting the embargo as I once was, but I would like a lifting of the embargo to be accompanied by a return to those the property that was stolen from them by the revolutionary government of Castro when they won the revolution more than 50 years ago.
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lasher View Post
    Not really. Alliance conditions really vary. There is no real way they can unite completely. So just take one country at a time and defeat it in detail. And if a country threatens with war, adopt a bait and bleed that contradicts with its interests so it's occupied with that.
    I have no idea what you're talking about.

    You said that Cuba is isolated. I showed that they are not. I have no idea what "unite completely" has to do with being isolated, nevermind taking one country at a time.

    another poster referred to your posts as incoherent. This one was a good example of that incoherence
    Last edited by sangha; 08-02-11 at 03:29 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  5. #75
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lasher View Post
    Judt read all the posts of mine. I've already gave you my opinion; now I'm talking about all the evidence that supports my opinion.
    You've posted no evidence. Only your opinions
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  6. #76
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Yes, then we can move rigs into the North Cuba Basin and start drilling for oil.

  7. #77
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Polotick View Post
    He is our creation.
    And that, ladies and gentlemen, is called "Blame America First". Every dictatator, every tyrant, every act of oppression and terrorism... America caused it.


    Keep the embargo, Castro is a mass-murdering totalitarian dictator.
    Last edited by ecofarm; 08-02-11 at 03:42 AM.

  8. #78
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    I think its time.

    The US simply cannot claim its for human rights anymore, or to make sure they're not supporting a communist or totalitarian regime. Its a ludicrous argument and your foreign policy for the last 50 years does not stand up to scrutiny with it. The Cuban regime are puppy dogs compared to other regimes you have supported in the past.

    With your trading policies with China since Nixon, you've basically single handedly made them one of the most powerful nations on Earth. Why all this hoohaw over Cuba?

    The cold war is over and has been for a long time, opening up your markets to Cuba and restoring relations could very well hasten Cubas long road to democracy. Isolating it seems to have only strengthened the regime.

    Oh wait yeah... we gotta win Florida with the large Cuban expat population.

    How stupid of me
    I agree! I have a musician friend who goes there annually and he says the people are wonderful, and have you had one of their cigars?
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    i'd imagine that cuba is better off with the embargo, actually. it's not like america isn't flooded with cuban
    cigars, regardless of the embargo. and side-stepping the whole "tax/tariff" situation to sell on the black market
    is probably preferable and more profitable to all concerned.
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  10. #80
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    Re: Should the Embargo with Cuba be lifted?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    And that, ladies and gentlemen, is called "Blame America First". Every dictatator, every tyrant, every act of oppression and terrorism... America caused it.


    Keep the embargo, Castro is a mass-murdering totalitarian dictator.
    Try to history. Since the 1800's American policy in Cuba was always from the position of superiority and greed.

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