View Poll Results: Do The Rich Need Saving?

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  • Yes

    7 10.00%
  • No

    59 84.29%
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    4 5.71%
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Thread: Do The Rich Need Saving?

  1. #71
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    THEY DO PAY MORE???? Do you not understand simple math dealing with total percentages of income?!?!?!
    Insults aside, where did I say they didn't pay more.

    But in stark contrast to, say, social programs, tax breaks vastly favor the rich over the middle class and the poor.

    They vastly favor people who own homes (especially expensive homes), can put a lot away for their retirements, have generous health insurance plans and live in high-tax states. Even something as simple as the deduction for charitable donations favors the wealthy: Because they pay higher marginal tax rate, they get a bigger federal subsidy for each dollar they give.

    The Top 10 Tax Breaks — And How They Help The Wealthy The Most | CAPITALISM IS OVER IF YOU WANT IT

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  2. #72
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    Talking Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by Oberon View Post
    Really? Gates invented computers and software??? They wouldn't have been invented without him or Jobs??? Amazing. Did they invent the internet too? How about Snapple?

    And here we all thought the Federal government paid for the research that led to all that, and the universities, and the employees training, protected the markets they're sold in, the shipping lanes, the interstate highways making the markets accessible, patent law protections, etc., etc, etc, etc, ad infinitum that made them possible, or conceivable in the first place.

    But, no, it was Bill Gates and Steve Jobs!!!

    And Reagan! We wouldn't have a computer industry if the Grenadans hadn't been driven back in the very nick of time.

    Thanks Ron, and Bill, and Steve!
    What a load of BS. Bill Gates didn't invent computers or software. Gates and his partner, Paul Allen took an existing operating system CPM and converted it to run on IBM's new desktop computer and called it DOS. There were many people involved with creating the computers we know today, not just Gates and Jobs. Much of what Microsoft produces are knockoffs of what others have produced. The internet was once a system for use by the military -ARANET. It was Sen. Al Gore that had the vision to convert it to what was then known as the Information Super Highway.


  3. #73
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    Thinks that some people need to look up the definition of “fair” in the dictionary, by definition a progressive tax system is not fair. Being fair is not allowing 47% of the working population to pay no federal income tax, while 10% of the working population pays roughly 45% of all federal income tax … so I guess I need to ask some here what is their meaning … when they say they want someone to pay their “fair” share ??

    Then it comes to getting from the government, while those 47 percent that pay nothing, apparently still uses everything the government supplies, and pay nothing …. are they paying their “fair” share?

    10 percent of the working pay for 45% of the cost of building and maintaining those same things … now to many percentages don't mean much so lets put actual numbers to this … there are roughly 150 million people in our work force.

    47% or 70,500,000 people pay nothing in federal income tax to pay for these things, using 2008 figures 10% of the population or 15 million people paid 45% of 2.5 trillion or or 922 billion dollars

    So in all fairness … tell me who paid their fair share

    15 million people that paid 922 billion dollars in federal income tax
    or
    70.5 million people that paid nothing in federal income tax ??
    Why does this 47% statistic always leave out the fact that these people are too poor to pay anything? They have nothing to pay. What would you have them do? Lose their homes? Give up eating for a month? When a family is living paycheck to paycheck, they need every dollar they can get. That cannot be said of any other income level.
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  4. #74
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    I never understood this mentality that taxes are a punishment. It's not like higher income ever reaches diminishing returns. Or that somehow strengthening the country as a whole by providing more resources for it to accomplish its goals is somehow a punishment. If we all pitch in, the nation becomes stronger, and we all benefit. Even using the term punishment is strange to me. It supposes that government is an authoritarian parent, rather than an organization that exists for no other purpose than to execute our will. It works for us, not the other way around. (Not getting into the issues of how vast corporate wealth makes the government only work for the highest bidder.)

    Taxes are just paying the upkeep on the country. That's it. To say that taxes are a punishment would be to say that paying for something you buy is a punishment. No one takes that position, do they? We put money, the fruit of our collective labor, into the coffer, and the government then gives us things in return. It's a business transaction. And to reap the benefits of that government, and the fruits of everyone's collective labor (because absolutely no one only lives off of the fruits of their own labor), and then demand not to pay for them... that's like eating a feast at a restaurant and then skipping out on the bill.
    100% agree with the whole post, especially your comments on tax as "punishment".

  5. #75
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by celticwar17 View Post
    THEY DO PAY MORE???? Do you not understand simple math dealing with total percentages of income?!?!?!
    As a percentage of their income, the rich pay less.


  6. #76
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Exist? Sure. Use? No. The wealthy use them more, and benefit from them more.
    That goes straight back to my argument that truck drivers benefit more from the existence of an interstate highway system, therefore they ought to pay more gas taxes. It makes no sense to support one without the other. Besides, tons of people have access to and use the stock market. I do. There's a whole category of people called day traders who do. In fact, just about everyone out there who has a retirement account does. Do we tax them all at a higher rate? Or are you just trying to single out a particular group of people that you don't like to stick it to? If you want to charge a usage tax in the stock market for anyone and everyone who ever performs a transaction, say so. Limiting it to some group of people who may or may not use it, just because you're jealous of their wealth is ridiculous.
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  7. #77
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    As a percentage of their income, the rich pay less.
    I'm not sure if that's entirely true. I've never been able to find real data on effective federal tax rates in the US. If anyone can find this data, please share.
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  8. #78
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    As a percentage of their income, the rich pay less.
    I'm not sure that's entirely true. When you get rich enough, yes you can claim your income to be not income and pay less taxes and lower your tax rate. Buffet and folk like that are rich enough to do so, and do. Buffet pays a lower marginal tax rate than his secretary. However, there is certainly a significantly large group of rich people who, while rich, are not rich enough to buy Congress and those poor jerks pay a LOT of taxes.
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I'm not sure if that's entirely true. I've never been able to find real data on effective federal tax rates in the US. If anyone can find this data, please share.
    The us is said to have the only tax system where the rich pa less....... as far as I know. In a general statement.

  10. #80
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    Re: Do The Rich Need Saving?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    That goes straight back to my argument that truck drivers benefit more from the existence of an interstate highway system, therefore they ought to pay more gas taxes. It makes no sense to support one without the other. Besides, tons of people have access to and use the stock market. I do. There's a whole category of people called day traders who do. In fact, just about everyone out there who has a retirement account does. Do we tax them all at a higher rate? Or are you just trying to single out a particular group of people that you don't like to stick it to? If you want to charge a usage tax in the stock market for anyone and everyone who ever performs a transaction, say so. Limiting it to some group of people who may or may not use it, just because you're jealous of their wealth is ridiculous.
    How do truck drivers benefit more than their employers? The drivers don't reap the profits from moving goods around the country. The very nature of employing a truck driver requires that the employers make more from moving the goods than the driver does. Else they would do the driving themselves.
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