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Thread: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

  1. #501
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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    I understand perfectly-you want people to pay based on their ability (from each according to their ability). I reject that. If you receive the same value you ought to pay the same but I will accept paying the same percentage even if that means the second guy pays many times more for the same value
    Also, I don't want people to pay according to their ability ... I just don't see the point in taxing those who have no money to be taxed ... how is that going to help anything? I am looking at the big picture, taxing those who have nothing will only keep them in poverty ... what is your reasoning to taxing those who have nothing? what do we gain from it? what utility does it have?
    Last edited by MusicAdventurer; 07-19-11 at 01:58 PM.

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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by evanescence View Post
    The overwhelming majority of average people in both of these countries lives in poverty with a small percentage of people living in luxury. Ultimately, capitalism ends in some type of feudalism.
    I would have said UNBRIDLED capitalism, but I agree with you...
    As long as the capitalists run the politicians and the politicians run the country, we are in trouble...

    Our kids are grown, ages 38 and 40. I tell them to invest where they live, in their homes. Pay off ALL debt as soon as possible, don't incur any other debt. If you have debt other than a mortgage, you should not be investing in the stock market...
    Like they say, gamble only with money you can afford to lose...
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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    You just don't get it. You are blind to philosophies that reject your belief that the main issue is cost imposed on a person. What is really selfish is saying those who can afford more taxes (based on your belief that they don't need all that "extra money") havea duty to not only pay what they use but to pay for thousands of others. You are far more selfish than me because you want to impose massive costs on others merely because they are more industrious than you are. You reject the entire concept of paying your share for what you get
    Please TurtleDude, don't assume you know what I am thinking unless I have said it .. that is very rude. If you want to know what I am thinking and why I see things the way I do, just ask me.

    Secondly, as I posted above, please help me understand the utility in taxing those who have nothing? i.e. what good does it do?

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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    If you understood what I am saying, I don't think you would think that the wealth are heavily burdened by paying more taxes than the poor .. I mean seriously ... do you think its such a burden to the wealthy? Give me a break! Are you basing your opinion on some illogical ideological principle that is completely selfish in nature, or do care at all about your fellow man/woman?
    I know a fellow like TD, his kids are parasites....they live off him. That is fine for now, but eventually he will pass and his kids will have to fend for themselves, or live on the public dole. Guess which is more likely....
    Oracle of Utah
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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by MusicAdventurer View Post
    So India is an example of true free market capitalism aye?. Again, you are not providing fully truthful information, no one is arguing that capitalism does not have is positive qualities ... however, you seem to refuse to admit that capitalism needs to be regulated .. am I hearing you argument correctly?
    Who is debating "true free market capitalism"? I'm not. And why did you mix "true" in with free market? And why then tack on capitalism too? Clearly I wrote about economic capitalism.

    Similar to this:
    Originally Posted by sangha
    Private enterprise alone does not make a system capitalism
    Are you guys really arguing about "true free markets" not existing? The same is done with "True marxist states", or "true socialist regimes". It's absurd to argue about that sort of thing. Forgive me if I assumed that just couldn't be what you're debating.

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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    You just don't get it. You are blind to philosophies that reject your belief that the main issue is cost imposed on a person. What is really selfish is saying those who can afford more taxes (based on your belief that they don't need all that "extra money") havea duty to not only pay what they use but to pay for thousands of others. You are far more selfish than me because you want to impose massive costs on others merely because they are more industrious than you are. You reject the entire concept of paying your share for what you get
    Rightwingers just don't get it. They are blind to philosophies that reject their belief that the main issue is cost imposed on a person. What is really selfish is saying those who can afford more taxes (based on their belief that they are entitled to all that "extra money") have no duty to pay their fair share and stop stealing from others. They are far more selfish than anyone else because they want to impose massive costs on the middle class merely because they are more industrious than the rich are. They reject the entire concept of paying their fair share, so they claim that people should pay for what they use even though they can't even explain how that works
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    As long as the capitalists run the politicians and the politicians run the country, we are in trouble...
    OK. Let me ask you this Utah. If politicians had less power over us, i.e. were less able to "run our lives", would that not be a reasonable solution to your proposed problem?
    Capitalist run politicians, but politicans can't effectively run our lives...problem solved? For that matter, why would they invest so much time and energy into controlling politicians if it didn't get them results anyway.

    Consider the federal budget, can we cut that by 50% and still keep strong corporate regulation and enforcement, considering the largest budget items are not related to regulation and enforcement?
    Last edited by Mach; 07-19-11 at 03:26 PM.

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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    Who is debating "true free market capitalism"? I'm not. And why did you mix "true" in with free market? And why then tack on capitalism too? Clearly I wrote about economic capitalism.
    The rightwingers in this thread. Their free market ideology is what they base their objections to a progressive tax on


    Are you guys really arguing about "true free markets" not existing? The same is done with "True marxist states", or "true socialist regimes". It's absurd to argue about that sort of thing. Forgive me if I assumed that just couldn't be what you're debating.
    The only ones who claim that these "true marxist" and "true socialist" states exist are the rightwingers who are pushing for a "true free market". And yes, their arguments are absurd

    The most absurd was claiming that China and India were examples of a free market economy
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    The rightwingers in this thread. Their free market ideology is what they base their objections to a progressive tax on




    The only ones who claim that these "true marxist" and "true socialist" states exist are the rightwingers who are pushing for a "true free market". And yes, their arguments are absurd

    The most absurd was claiming that China and India were examples of a free market economy
    Exactly, and the word "true" had to be added because these people arguing that China and India were free markets couldn't understand that while these were examples of economies that had qualities of the theory of a free market, these were indeed not examples of free markets in the truest sense of the theory.

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    Re: Do You Want Higher Taxes?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mach View Post
    You're dodging. Stop. This directly addresses your post
    http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...post1059662383


    Answered:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy...ublic_of_China


    China was centrally planned (under communism of course) and was stagnant for decades.
    They added capitalism to their markets and it EXPLODED, taking their poverty rate from 53% to 2.5%. Freedom good eh?

    Of course that's just one example. Freedoms in the marketplace are prone to lifting entire populations out of poverty, improving quality of life, giving more people political and social power, etc.

    So is your point that free markets operating under Communism work better than free markets operating under a Democracy?
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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