Should Republicans agree to Tax Increases.....and commit political suicide?

LizardofOz · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
Good Gawd.....Are those Obama knee pads wearing out yet?

The last bunch was plenty decisive my willfully ignorant friend.........and they decided to cram excrement sandwhich after excrement sandwhich down the throats of We The People.......

And if Democrats raise taxes in this recession.........and revenues fail to increase or barely increase.....WHAT THEN?

.....more tax increases of course......

Kind of like every bureaucrat in Washington? Kind of like every government agency?
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The last bunch of so indecisive that they couldn't even agree to phase out the Bush tax-cuts on the wealthy when they had a super majority, and it took them a year longer than Obama had intended to push the healthcare laws for, watered down the healthcare laws, and yeah as a Democrat I will say this; they are a bunch of indecisive ******s. Sometimes that is good, but usually very bad for getting democracy done.

We are not in a recession, however we will be in one if our government as a whole doesn't do something, it will be far bigger than the last, and this time they won't be able to plug any holes.

Right now no matter who was in power, if there was a super majority of Republicans or Democrats or a mix like there is now, America is like a ship with a hole in the bottom, leaking water, and our government has to find a way to get it in the right direction.

However I am glad we can agree the military needs spending cuts as well. To me it only makes sense to quit funding operations in Libya, get totally out of Iraqi, close up shop in Kuwait, tell Pakistan to go **** itself, and withdraw at a much faster rate from Afghanistan.

repeter · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
I started a business in the Most Business Unfriendly Country in the world.........

I hired poeple in the Most Employer Unfriendly Country in the world........

I started paying outrageous taxes with my checkbook.......

.........and as it would happen....as it has happened....with virtually everyone that tread the steps I now take and those that walk in the footseps I laid........you see the reality of statism......you see that Liberalism is the complete lie and utter fraud it has always been.

Plenty of people pay taxes, and are small business owners. Plenty of people dislike paying taxes, and don't like the regulations we have. An immeasurably small percentage of them actually come to hold the views you hold.

There has got to be some other reason for why you essentially hate liberals.

LizardofOz · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
I started a business in the Most Business Unfriendly Country in the world.........

I hired poeple in the Most Employer Unfriendly Country in the world........

I started paying outrageous taxes with my checkbook.......

.........and as it would happen....as it has happened....with virtually everyone that tread the steps I now take and those that walk in the footseps I laid........you see the reality of statism......you see that Liberalism is the complete lie and utter fraud it has always been.
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Lot's of bad information in here. Try paying the taxes you would in Canada or Switzerland. Going by what I assume is you definition they are FAR more employer unfriendly and they have better economies than U.S. right now.

Badmutha · Jul 12, 2011

JohnWOlin said:
Lot's of bad information in here. Try paying the taxes you would in Canada or Switzerland. Going by what I assume is you definition they are FAR more employer unfriendly and they have better economies than U.S. right now.

Well Canada and even Switzerland look more appealing everyday.........

Welcome to Reality.........and why US Companies ship jobs overseas........and why no foreign Company ships jobs to the US........

....when every business has left these shores......the liberal utopia you expect isnt going to be the gumdrops and lollipops the Democrat Party promised.
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SheWolf · Jul 12, 2011

They should be willing to compromise, even if it's a small increase on millionaires... I think they need to show they are willing to work with the president and fix the budget crisis..

Badmutha · Jul 12, 2011

JohnWOlin said:
The last bunch of so indecisive that they couldn't even agree to phase out the Bush tax-cuts on the wealthy when they had a super majority, and it took them a year longer than Obama had intended to push the healthcare laws for, watered down the healthcare laws, and yeah as a Democrat I will say this; they are a bunch of indecisive ******s. Sometimes that is good, but usually very bad for getting democracy done.

Seeing Democrat Excrement Sandwhiches for what they are......doesnt equate indecisiveness. They passed plenty of legislation.....almost entirely bad for this country and bad for the economy.......but they still passed it.

We are not in a recession, however we will be in one if our government as a whole doesn't do something, it will be far bigger than the last, and this time they won't be able to plug any holes.

Well the government spending MORE MONEY........is not a plug.......and neither is raising taxes.

Right now no matter who was in power, if there was a super majority of Republicans or Democrats or a mix like there is now, America is like a ship with a hole in the bottom, leaking water, and our government has to find a way to get it in the right direction.

Well the Democrat solution is to put an addition on the sinking ship.........more government, more taxes, more subprime Democrat Social Programs to Nowhere..........

However I am glad we can agree the military needs spending cuts as well. To me it only makes sense to quit funding operations in Libya, get totally out of Iraqi, close up shop in Kuwait, tell Pakistan to go **** itself, and withdraw at a much faster rate from Afghanistan.

We agree....but we can't balance the budget on the backs of the military or with tax increases alone.
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Badmutha · Jul 12, 2011

repeter said:
Plenty of people pay taxes, and are small business owners. Plenty of people dislike paying taxes, and don't like the regulations we have. An immeasurably small percentage of them actually come to hold the views you hold.

Actually after Nov. 2 ,2010--The Largest Political Ass Whooping in history.......it seems my views are clearly in the majority.

There has got to be some other reason for why you essentially hate liberals.

I also lived in a liberal utopia/complete ****hole for some time.........
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Wiseone · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
Well Canada and even Switzerland look more appealing everyday.........

This chart is a perfect example of the flaw in so many of your arguments. That flaw being looking only at one factor and acting as if its the only one at play. For example the US easily has a better economic outlook than many of the countries on that list which according to your chart have lower coperate income tax rates, so if we only look at one factor than lowering tax rates would make us more like Greece, or Spain, or Portugal, or Ireland, or Mexico, or Italy. That doesn't help your argument.

Badmutha · Jul 12, 2011

SheWolf said:
They should be willing to compromise, even if it's a small increase on millionaires... I think they need to show they are willing to work with the president and fix the budget crisis..

Compromise and commit political suicide......I wouldnt.....

The top 1% pay almsot 40% of all the taxes........I believe that accounts for more than their "Fair Share".........
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cpwill · Jul 12, 2011

Wiseone said:
This chart is a perfect example of the flaw in so many of your arguments. That flaw being looking only at one factor and acting as if its the only one at play. For example the US easily has a better economic outlook than many of the countries on that list which according to your chart have lower coperate income tax rates, so if we only look at one factor than lowering tax rates would make us more like Greece, or Spain, or Portugal, or Ireland, or Mexico, or Italy. That doesn't help your argument.

the question seemed to be about Canada and Switzerland. however, you are right to point out that the corporate tax rate is only one factor.

you will notice that, when a large variety of factors are included, both Switzerland and Canada, are, in fact, enjoying economies that are freer than ours; with Switzerland occupying the #5 slot, Canada taking #6, and the US taking #9. Critically, while both of those economies are in the process of becoming even more free, we are in the process of becoming less free. Now, would you like to know how Canada and Switzerland are doing v the US when it comes to our "recovery"?

Badmutha · Jul 12, 2011

Wiseone said:
This chart is a perfect example of the flaw in so many of your arguments. That flaw being looking only at one factor and acting as if its the only one at play.

If you went to work tomorrow........with government seizing 40% of your profits.........would you say thats a pretty BIG FACTOR?

For example the US easily has a better economic outlook than many of the countries on that list which according to your chart have lower coperate income tax rates, so if we only look at one factor than lowering tax rates would make us more like Greece, or Spain, or Portugal, or Ireland, or Mexico, or Italy. That doesn't help your argument.

The mass exodus of US Companies and Employers......the absolute void of foreign companies shipping jobs to the US.........makes my argument......and wraps it and puts a big bow on it for you.
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Wiseone · Jul 12, 2011

cpwill said:
the question seemed to be about Canada and Switzerland. however, you are right to point out that the corporate tax rate is only one factor.

you will notice that, when a large variety of factors are included, both Switzerland and Canada, are, in fact, enjoying economies that are freer than ours; with Switzerland occupying the #5 slot, Canada taking #6, and the US taking #9. Critically, while both of those economies are in the process of becoming even more free, we are in the process of becoming less free. Now, would you like to know how Canada and Switzerland are doing v the US when it comes to our "recovery"?

O I'm not debating the US needs to loosen the chains so to speak, or that its impossible for other countries to have a better way. I was really arguing that Badmutha makes poor arguments. Heck even I have to acknowledge he can be right every now and then even if for all the wrong reasons, for example he stated earlier that we shoul cut military spending, I totally agree but I'm sure our reasons are completely different.

American · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
Maybe this guy can help.........

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If they vote for tax increases, they will hurt any Republican running for office. They will also go back on their promises. The tax increases will also not solve the problem. We already have one party (and some libertarians, you know who you are) that support tax increases....we don't need another.

Wiseone · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
If you went to work tomorrow........with government seizing 40% of your profits.........would you say thats a pretty BIG FACTOR?

I don't disagree that tax policy should be revised, along with a whole lot of other things. And I don't disagree that taxes should be as low as the situation allows, I was just pointing out your over simplification of an extremely compliticated issue.

Also I'm in the military, your taxes are my profit. I eat your taxes for breakfast. NOM NOM NOM

American · Jul 12, 2011

JohnWOlin said:
What Obama is proposing right now atm is not increasing taxes, it is getting rid of a variety of tax credits and close up loopholes. Increasing taxes would imply that an actual number is added to base tax codes. The real reason the Republicans took the house has little to do with their values and more to do with the last bunch was a lot of indecisive fools. Now we have a bunch of decisive fools, and they have decided to play chicken with the economy along with Obama.

Really the the main differences between Republicans and Democrats at this point is Democrats are willing to discuss cuts something they do not like at all. Republicans do not want to talk about raising revenues in anyway even if it were to only effect people that make bets on the economy such as hedge fund managers, people that literally contribute nothing to the actual products and services they bet on.

I disagree here, the Republicans took the House because Tea Party candidates said they would do something about bloated government. Raising taxes (directly or indirectly) makes them look like promise breakers to their voters.

samsmart · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
According to Obama-Pelosi-Reid and just about every Democrat in Washington to the liberal commoners here at DP.......Republicans should just agree to Tax Increases.......and commit political suicide.

Coming just a little over 8 months since Nov. 2,2010--The Largest Political Ass Whooping in History........if you were an elected Republican in Washington.....would you agree to raise taxes and commit political suicide?

I don't know any Republican or Tea Party member that was elected to go to Washington for the purpose of helping The Kenyan Tyrant and Democrats continue their evil ways........

........they were elected to stop The Kenyan Tyrant and the Democrat's hair brain agenda.......they were elected to cut spending.......they were elected to stop an ever growing ever expanding Liberal Nanny State Government. Not one of them promised to go to Washington and Raise Taxes........and if they do.....chances are they wont be going back come 2012.

Well, it really means what you mean by "tax increases."

Do you mean lowering the tax rates with a simplified tax code but increase the tax base so more people are paying those taxes?

Or do you mean by getting rid of targeted tax cuts to certain companies that benefit from the largesse of those Congressmen who receive campaign contributions from those companies when smaller businesses in other industries don't get the same consideration?

Or do you mean by getting rid of tax code loopholes that are to the advantage of only the wealthiest of our nation?

If so, then yes, Republicans should agree to those things that aren't actually tax cuts that will help generate more tax revenue to help pay off our debt and reduce our deficits.

Badmutha · Jul 12, 2011

American said:
If they vote for tax increases, they will hurt any Republican running for office. They will also go back on their promises. The tax increases will also not solve the problem. We already have one party (and some libertarians, you know who you are) that support tax increases....we don't need another.

Truer words were never spoken........

......although 100% of Democrats agree.........Republicans should just act like Democrats......compromise and commit their political harry carey.
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samsmart · Jul 12, 2011

American said:
I disagree here, the Republicans took the House because Tea Party candidates said they would do something about bloated government. Raising taxes (directly or indirectly) makes them look like promise breakers to their voters.

You're right.

But it was their fault for saying that the economy could be fixed only by cutting government spending. And I don't think it's right that these Congressmen should hold the American economy hostage because they made promises they can't keep.

cpwill · Jul 12, 2011

American said:
I disagree here, the Republicans took the House because Tea Party candidates said they would do something about bloated government. Raising taxes (directly or indirectly) makes them look like promise breakers to their voters.

precisely. I will send every dollar I can to every incumbent of worth I can find who runs against an (R) that votes for trillion dollar tax hikes as a way to "reduce government size and spending".

LizardofOz · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
Well Canada and even Switzerland look more appealing everyday.........

Welcome to Reality.........and why US Companies ship jobs overseas........and why no foreign Company ships jobs to the US........

....when every business has left these shores......the liberal utopia you expect isnt going to be the gumdrops and lollipops the Democrat Party promised.
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And how many American companies actually pay that rate when you look at the loopholes, tax breaks, and credits? Not to mention you got your information from a libertarian think tank.

LizardofOz · Jul 12, 2011

American said:
I disagree here, the Republicans took the House because Tea Party candidates said they would do something about bloated government. Raising taxes (directly or indirectly) makes them look like promise breakers to their voters.

Look at the people that voted for them though, is it going to hurt them if tax loopholes are closed up?

Bassman · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
But to believe that......one would have to believe its Government....specifically The Democrat Provided Social Teet..... that stops people from falling into homelessness, unemployment, or poverty.......

.....and I would say its just the opposite........

The Poorest American Cities of 2008 (1-30)

1. Detroit, 33.3% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 52 years
2. Cleveland, 30.5% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 20 years
3. Buffalo, 30.3% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 43 years
4. Newark, 26.1% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 102 years
5. Miami, 25.6% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 52 years
6. Fresno, 25.5% in poverty--Republican Mayor for the last 13 years
7. Cincinnati, 25.1% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 29 years
8. Toledo, 24.7% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 20 years
9. El Paso, 24.3% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 120 years
10.Philadelphia, 24.1% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 57 years
11. Milwaukee, 23.4% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 49 years
12. Memphis, 23.1% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 133 years
13. St. Louis, 22.9% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 60 years
14. Dallas, 22.6% in poverty--Republican Mayor for the last 2 years
14 New Orleans,22.6% in poverty-Democrat Mayor for the last 141 years
16. Atlanta, 22.4% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 130 years
17. Stockton, Calif., 21.6% in poverty--No info available--probably Libs
18. Minneapolis, 21.3% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 35 years
19. Pittsburgh, 21.2% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 21 years
20. Tucson, 20.9% in poverty--No info available--probably Libs
21. Chicago, 20.6% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 78 years
22. Columbus,Ohio 20.1% in poverty-Democrat Mayor for the last 9 years
23. Long Beach, Calif., 19.8% in poverty--No info available--probably Libs
24. Houston, 19.5% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 88 years
25 Los Angeles,19.4% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for "the last 8 years"
26. Baltimore, 19.3% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 42 years
27 San Antonio,19.2% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 38 years
28. Phoenix, 18.9% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 5 years
29. Boston, 18.7% in poverty--Democrat Mayor for the last 79 years
30. Denver, 18.4% in poverty----Democrat Mayor for the last 46 years

What if I told you we could lower the tax rate and collect more revenues?

Federal Tax Revenue After The Bush Tax Cuts

Federal Tax Revenue After The Reagan Tax Cuts

Federal Tax Revenue After The JFK/Johnson Tax Cuts

....you want to lower the deficit.......especially in this economy.........cut spending.......and then cut taxes.
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What's interesting is the last mayor to keep this city solvent was Mayor James D. Griffin who forced a primary in 1977. He was one of the last of the old-line Conservatives.

madman · Jul 12, 2011

Bassman said:
What's interesting is the last mayor to keep this city solvent was Mayor James D. Griffin who forced a primary in 1977. He was one of the last of the old-line Conservatives.

Nawwww...That's not a biased site.
I am Christopher Chantrill, writer and conservative.
Where is crissy getting his data from?:2wave:
LMAO

Badmutha · Jul 12, 2011

JohnWOlin said:
And how many American companies actually pay that rate when you look at the loopholes, tax breaks, and credits?

Looking at the Mass Exodus of US Companies, the complete void of Foreign Companies shipping jobs to the US........

........Plenty of them...........

Not to mention you got your information from a libertarian think tank.

Which source will make you believe reality?
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repeter · Jul 12, 2011

Badmutha said:
Looking at the Mass Exodus of US Companies, the complete void of Foreign Companies shipping jobs to the US........
........Plenty of them...........
Which source will make you believe reality?

You have to answer that before we do. And until you do, it'd be counterproductive to answer yours.

Should Republicans agree to Tax Increases.....and commit political suicide?

Should Republicans agree to Tax Increases.....and commit political suicide?

Yes

No

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