View Poll Results: What is worse Communism or Anarchy?

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  • Communism

    12 57.14%
  • Anarchy

    6 28.57%
  • Both the same

    2 9.52%
  • Caspar the friendly ghost

    1 4.76%
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Thread: Whats worse?

  1. #11
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    Re: Whats worse?

    No doubt communism.

  2. #12
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    Re: Whats worse?

    Both are extreme, and result in the break down of society. In both scenarios, lots of people would die. There would be very little economic success because neither central planning nor no planning at all will work.
    “In politics, stupidity is not a handicap.” -Napoleon

  3. #13
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    Re: Whats worse?

    I have to consider outcomes, though, because I am much more of a realist than an idealist.
    So am I. I don't believe humans can obtain more than a modicum of the virtue necessary to maintain any kind of society very well. That modicum is the difference between success and decline, however.

    Well, I agree with your assessment that anarchism is only an intermediary, but that is only taking the outcome into consideration. There are anarchists who believe in anarchy as a stable end-state.
    I'm aware that noting that anarchy was intermediary contradicted my subsequent assertion about the importance of virtues over specific political systems in the acquisition of success, but I was working from the idea that anarchy required "that much more" additional virtue.

    I can agree with this, except that some systems are worse than others. However, human behavior is the root problem.
    Some system impose heavier demands than others. I suppose that makes them "worse", though a less sympathetic interpretation is that humans aren't worthy of them.
    Last edited by Morality Games; 07-08-11 at 07:15 PM.
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  4. #14
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    Re: Whats worse?

    I will say that anarchy is worse, because I believe it will likely be more bloody and deadly than communism as it would inevitably give rise to sectarian violence and then devolve into a dictatorship. At least communism would devolve into a dictatorship without all the bloodshed first.

  5. #15
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    Re: Whats worse?

    Quote Originally Posted by Morality Games View Post
    So am I. I don't believe humans can obtain more than a modicum of the virtue necessary to maintain any kind of society very well. That modicum is the difference between success and decline, however.

    I'm aware that noting that anarchy was intermediary contradicted my subsequent assertion about the importance of virtues over specific political systems in the acquisition of success, but I was working from the idea that anarchy required "that much more" additional virtue.

    Some system impose heavier demands than others. I suppose that makes them "worse", though a less sympathetic interpretation is that humans aren't worthy of them.
    I'm with you on this. However I look at communism as just as demanding -- actually more demanding -- in the sense you use, than anarchism. But they are both idealism of the same stripe, and manifest in reality as transitional states collapsing (or growing) into something more stable (less demanding).

  6. #16
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    Re: Whats worse?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    I will say that anarchy is worse, because I believe it will likely be more bloody and deadly than communism as it would inevitably give rise to sectarian violence and then devolve into a dictatorship. At least communism would devolve into a dictatorship without all the bloodshed first.
    Wouldn't anarchy then be better? I'd rather a bloody battle to protect my freedoms than simply allow someone to take them all away.
    Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

  7. #17
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    Re: Whats worse?

    Quote Originally Posted by Helvidius View Post
    Wouldn't anarchy then be better? I'd rather a bloody battle to protect my freedoms than simply allow someone to take them all away.
    Totalitarianism would be inevitable in either case, however, in the communism scenario, I think I would be less likely to die. However, if you want to battle during anarchy go ahead, but I suspect you will be too busy simply trying to stay alive and away from the bandits, lack of infrastructure, factions/gangs trying to survive, the lack of available food, the uselessness of all forms of currency, etc.
    Last edited by tacomancer; 07-08-11 at 08:37 PM.

  8. #18
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    Re: Whats worse?

    You need to define those words a little better. If you're talking about Marxism and Anarcho-syndicalism, the systems are pretty much indistinguishable. You could also be talking about Soviet-style socialism and anarcho-capitalism, which are about as far apart as two systems can get. Or you could be talking about chaotic, unstructured anarchy, as in Somalia. I'll go ahead and assume you're talking about chaotic anarchy and Soviet-style socialism, in which case I'd say anarchy is the better choice. Chaos means opportunity.
    For: legalizing drugs, gay marriage, abortion, guns, universal health care, public sector jobs, nuclear power, free education, progressive taxation
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  9. #19
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    Re: Whats worse?

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Totalitarianism would be inevitable in either case,
    why do you think totalitarianism would be inevitable after anarchism? Seems like any number of different outcomes would be possible, the most likely being some form of manorialism or warlordism, where certain familial groups accumulate land and power. It'd be a few steps before any single person or group could gain total control over everyone, and until then it might be turned in another direction.

    Communism, on the other hand, needs a lot of central power to ensure the proper distribution of labor/capital/etc, and to prevent people from reacquiring private property. It starts, for all practical purposes, as a ready-made totalitarian power.

    however, in the communism scenario, I think I would be less likely to die.
    I don't know... You might live a little longer, because starvation can take a while...

    But really, as you mentioned earlier, anarchism would lead to bloodshed, but so would communism. In communism it would just come a little later -- problem is, it's much more systematic and insidious. Anarchism would be random violence between groups, communism devolves into purges, secret police, rationing, extreme rationing, confiscation, witch hunts for internal subversives, etc.

  10. #20
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    Re: Whats worse?

    Well communism and anarchism both strive for the same goals per say.
    But what form of communism and what form of anarchism?


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