View Poll Results: Should male circumcision be banned?

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  • Yes

    13 19.70%
  • No

    53 80.30%
  • Yes, but allow a clause for religious beliefs.

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Thread: Should male circumcision be banned?

  1. #211
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    Male circumcision elicits no harmful effects. Not a word from you however on things that really are potentially harmful to the body such as repetitive cosmetic surgery, liposuction gone bad, tanning beds, etc.
    Have you even bothered to look into the matter?


    Circumcision - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    Have you even bothered to look into the matter?
    Circumcision - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    I have. I am a Doctor/Doctora licensed in the United States/Israel. The application of local anesthesia profoundly minimizes procedural pain. Medical complications post-circumcision are typically confined to blood loss and infection. The incidence of such complications in Western populations is below that of other minor surgical procedures such as body-piercings. The inclusion of statistics from third-world populations heightens/skewers the global complications-curve due to the high probabilities of local practitioners (not licensed) and unsanitary conditions.

    I have never encountered sexual complaints from a male due to circumcision. Although three out of every four men in the Middle East have been circumcised, erectile functionality and fertility are not compromised. Birthrates throughout the region remain very high.

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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    I am still pretty astonished at how emotional and downright vicious some people get over this issue. Particularly baffling is that many of the most irate don't have a penis! :


    WTH is the big deal? Let those who want to do it, do it; those who don't, don't.

    I mean WTF? My parents had me circumcised at birth; I don't give a ****. My son was circumcised at birth; he's never had any problems. Times when I've had to use communal showers or common changing rooms, something like 95% of the men appeared to be circumcised as far as I noticed, and I've yet to meet a single man who's told me it caused him problems or he wished he hadn't been.

    If you don't like it, don't do it. Dayum.
    I avoided this thread for 200 posts because wtf do I care, and you posted exactly what I was thinking. LOL!

  4. #214
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    A lot of what you say I have no disagreement with and instead focus on the matters I had brought up previously that have been ignored by circumcisions advocates.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shayah View Post
    I have. I am a Doctor/Doctora licensed in the United States/Israel.
    Your specialty being?

    Do you currently or have you previously performed circumcisions? If not, at what date and from where did you obtain your information on this matter?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shayah View Post
    The application of local anesthesia profoundly minimizes procedural pain.
    Yes, it reduces the pain for an entirely unnecessary procedure. I'm sure if we wanted to remove the toenails of babies we could also do so pain-free with local anesthetics. The point is that there is no MEDICALLY NECESSARY reason to do it except in extremely rare cases.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shayah View Post
    Medical complications post-circumcision are typically confined to blood loss and infection.
    Yes, the most TYPICAL complications are. As in, the complications that most commonly occur. There are far more complications that occur, some quite devastating to the sexual life of the individual all because of an MEDICALLY UNNECESSARY surgery.

    Keeping with the toenail analogy, I'm sure we could become quite proficient in toenail removal with minimal complications. But its would still be an UNNECESSARY EVASIVE medical procedure.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shayah View Post
    The incidence of such complications in Western populations is below that of other minor surgical procedures such as body-piercings.
    Can you back that up? Are these body piercings performed by medical professionals? If not, isn't that comparing apples to oranges because medical professionals are subject to much more stringent standards of sanitation and oversight than places that perform body-piercings?

    That is, if circumcisions were allowed in the same places as body piercings were with staff with similar minimal training, do you honestly think that the rate of complications from circumcisions would remain the same?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shayah View Post
    The inclusion of statistics from third-world populations heightens/skewers the global complications-curve due to the high probabilities of local practitioners (not licensed) and unsanitary conditions.
    Even more reason why this MEDICALLY UNNECESSARY surgery should NOT be performed.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shayah View Post
    I have never encountered sexual complaints from a male due to circumcision.
    Which tells us what exactly? It appears you are attempting to pass off your anecdotal experiences as legitimate research and study. Is this same thought process how you come to conclusions on other medical matters as a doctor?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shayah View Post
    Although three out of every four men in the Middle East have been circumcised, erectile functionality and fertility are not compromised. Birthrates throughout the region remain very high.
    http://www.ama-assn.org/resources/doc/csaph/csai-99.pdf
    page 17; Neonatal Circumcision
    Conclusions. Although potential medical benefits are associated with newborn male
    circumcision, these data are not sufficient to recommend routine performance of this procedure
    on medical grounds
    . However, in the United States, parental decision-making appears to be
    based on social and cultural rather than medical concerns. When the decision is made to proceed
    with circumcision, local anesthesia should be provided for the procedure.
    RECOMMENDATIONS
    The following statements, recommended by the Council on Scientific Affairs, were adopted by the
    AMA House of Delegates as AMA policy at the 1999 AMA Interim Meeting.
    1. The AMA encourages training programs for pediatricians, obstetricians, and family
    physicians to incorporate information on the use of local pain control techniques for
    neonatal circumcision.
    2. The AMA supports the general principles of the 1999 Circumcision Policy Statement of
    the American Academy of Pediatrics, which reads as follows: Existing scientific evidence
    demonstrates potential medical benefits of newborn male circumcision; however, these
    data are not sufficient to recommend routine neonatal circumcision. In circumstances in
    which there are potential benefits and risks, yet the procedure is not essential to the
    child's current well-being
    , parents should determine what is in the best interest of the
    child. To make an informed choice, parents of all male infants should be given accurate
    and unbiased information and be provided the opportunity to discuss this decision. If a
    decision for circumcision is made, procedural analgesia should be provided.
    3. The AMA urges that as part of the informed consent discussion, the risks and benefits of
    pain control techniques for circumcision be thoroughly discussed to aid parents in making
    their decisions.

    Neonatal Circumcision Revisited
    Conclusions

    We undertook this literature review to consider whether the CPS should change its position on routine neonatal circumcision from that stated in 1982. The review led us to conclude the following.

    There is evidence that circumcision results in an approximately 12-fold reduction in the incidence of UTI during infancy. The overall incidence of UTI in male infants appears to be 1% to 2%.
    The incidence rate of the complications of circumcision reported in published articles varies, but it is generally in the order of 0.2% to 2%. Most complications are minor, but occasionally serious complications occur. There is a need for good epidemiological data on the incidence of the surgical complications of circumcision, of the later complications of circumcision and of problems associated with lack of circumcision.
    Evaluation of alternative methods of preventing UTI in infancy is required.
    More information on the effect of simple hygienic interventions is needed.
    Information is required on the incidence of circumcision that is truly needed in later childhood.
    There is evidence that circumcision results in a reduction in the incidence of penile cancer and of HIV transmission. However, there is inadequate information to recommend circumcision as a public health measure to prevent these diseases.
    When circumcision is performed, appropriate attention needs to be paid to pain relief.
    The overall evidence of the benefits and harms of circumcision is so evenly balanced that it does not support recommending circumcision as a routine procedure for newborns. There is therefore no indication that the position taken by the CPS in 1982 should be changed.
    When parents are making a decision about circumcision, they should be advised of the present state of medical knowledge about its benefits and harms. Their decision may ultimately be based on personal, religious or cultural factors.
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  5. #215
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    A lot of what you say I have no disagreement with and instead focus on the matters I had brought up previously that have been ignored by circumcisions advocates.


    Your specialty being?

    Do you currently or have you previously performed circumcisions? If not, at what date and from where did you obtain your information on this matter?


    Yes, it reduces the pain for an entirely unnecessary procedure. I'm sure if we wanted to remove the toenails of babies we could also do so pain-free with local anesthetics. The point is that there is no MEDICALLY NECESSARY reason to do it except in extremely rare cases.


    Yes, the most TYPICAL complications are. As in, the complications that most commonly occur. There are far more complications that occur, some quite devastating to the sexual life of the individual all because of an MEDICALLY UNNECESSARY surgery.

    Keeping with the toenail analogy, I'm sure we could become quite proficient in toenail removal with minimal complications. But its would still be an UNNECESSARY EVASIVE medical procedure.


    Can you back that up? Are these body piercings performed by medical professionals? If not, isn't that comparing apples to oranges because medical professionals are subject to much more stringent standards of sanitation and oversight than places that perform body-piercings?

    That is, if circumcisions were allowed in the same places as body piercings were with staff with similar minimal training, do you honestly think that the rate of complications from circumcisions would remain the same?


    Even more reason why this MEDICALLY UNNECESSARY surgery should NOT be performed.


    Which tells us what exactly? It appears you are attempting to pass off your anecdotal experiences as legitimate research and study. Is this same thought process how you come to conclusions on other medical matters as a doctor?



    http://www.ama-assn.org/resources/doc/csaph/csai-99.pdf
    page 17; Neonatal Circumcision



    Neonatal Circumcision Revisited
    Ok, so by that logic, no more boob jobs or liposuction, etc because they are medically unnecessary.
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  6. #216
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by DashingAmerican View Post
    Ok, so by that logic, no more boob jobs or liposuction, etc because they are medically unnecessary.
    I would certainly hope that people wouldn't do that to newborn children unless its medically necessary.
    Last edited by scourge99; 07-05-11 at 05:44 AM.
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    BAsically what that all boiled down to was the AMA stating that while there are benefits, in the U.S. they are not recommending that doctors routinely ush the procedure. I don't disagree with that. It should be the parents decision in most cases.

    Of course, based upon the CDC article I posted, they may want to rethink that if they are talking about what's the best avenue to take in certan other countries with very high incidents of sexually transmitted diseases.

  8. #218
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Understanding how the penis functions is more important than what you remember.
    Granted I'm only on page 5 of 22 (at time of post) but you have yet to show any evidence as to your assertion that circumcision causes loss of sensation over time. The study would have to show a comparison of circumcised and uncircumcised men across at least the country if not across the world to counter the possibility of simply age being the cause and regional "pollutants" (for lack of a better term) being the cause.

    As for my personal opinion at this time, I can understand a law that bans the practice on any non-adult. You are basically forcing a permanent religious decision (in most cases) on someone before they can make an informed decision about it. Even forced attendances at a religious institution can be reversed. Circumcision cannot. However, the practice should not be banned in and of itself. For that matter, if an adult female wants to get a circumcision as well, then by all means, go for it.

  9. #219
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    I would certainly hope that people wouldn't do that to newborn children unless its medically necessary.
    when is a boob job or liposucition EVER a medical necessity?
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  10. #220
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    Re: Should male circumcision be banned?

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    when is a boob job or liposucition EVER a medical necessity?
    To me, boob jobs look fake and they're a turn off. I prefer natural.

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