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Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

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  • Total voters
    22

Juiposa

is totally not a robot.
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What do you think of Russia?

Is it getting better? Or getting worse? Or is it the same as in Soviet Days.?


IMO Russia has level with the USSR. It has gotten better in economics and freeoms, but losing out in corruption and how much the government actually cares about its people.
 
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Not as bad by a long shot in my opinion. In the Soviet Union there was killing and basically slave labor. Now its kind of organize anarchy, so people are more free to do whatever they want, practice what they want. They have become a lot more globalized now too, instead of so secluded; they are still cultural lunatics but much better then they used to be.
 
Oh goodie, this discussion.

Economically, things are certainly much better. People are free to practice their religions, which is also a good thing. Murders per capita are still unusually high, which is amazing considering how much it's improved since the nineties. I would say the biggest problems revolve around political rights, civil liberties, and general corporate corruption. Russia is a very psychologically complex country...it'll take generations to break them of certain habits.

You have to understand -- lying and cheating were considered acceptable in Soviet culture. You know how here, in the USA, students get in trouble for cheating? Well the psychology for my parents was totally different. It was almost expected that you would cheat, bribe the instructor, and generally behave in a dishonest fashion. That's how people operate survive under a centralized, repressive state....and Russia has had one of those for centuries.

The endemic problems of Russian psychology are alive and well -- in some cases worse than before. I don't see them going away in my lifetime.

I hate to say this but...the problem with Russia is that it's full of Russians.
 
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Oh goodie, this discussion.

You have to understand -- lying and cheating were considered acceptable in Soviet culture. You know how here, in the USA, students get in trouble for cheating? Well the psychology for my parents was totally different. It was almost expected that you would cheat, bribe the instructor, and generally behave in a dishonest fashion. That's how people operate survive under a centralized, repressive state....and Russia has had one of those for centuries.

Well that certainly explains Russian women. They are EVIL!
 
Well that certainly explains Russian women. They are EVIL!

Pfft. Don't whine because your bitch-control game was weak. :pimpdaddy:


EDIT: Wow...it didn't censor that.
 
Pfft. Don't whine because your bitch-control game was weak. :pimpdaddy:


EDIT: Wow...it didn't censor that.

Hell I dont even go that far man. Far to much trouble. I want to avoid getting to the point where I want to push em out of the car for a Tuck and Roll, going 20mph.
 
You have to understand -- lying and cheating were considered acceptable in Soviet culture. You know how here, in the USA, students get in trouble for cheating? Well the psychology for my parents was totally different. It was almost expected that you would cheat, bribe the instructor, and generally behave in a dishonest fashion. That's how people operate survive under a centralized, repressive state....and Russia has had one of those for centuries.

Isn't the lying and cheating culture still much the same, despite the change in political structure?
 
Isn't the lying and cheating culture still much the same, despite the change in political structure?

Well yeah that's my point, if you read the whole post.
 
Well yeah that's my point, if you read the whole post.

OIC. I misread to think you meant that's how people behave in a repressive communist state, but now I see you meant any kind of repressive state. Russia had a very repressive one before the USSR. It's sad when people are expected to cheat as if there were nothing wrong with that.
 
Russia is still a dictatorship, but it's much more well run now. The economy is doing well, and you're not really in any danger from the government unless you directly screw with Bad Vlad. It's actually one of the best dictatorships in history, IMO.
 
Russia is still a dictatorship, but it's much more well run now. The economy is doing well, and you're not really in any danger from the government unless you directly screw with Bad Vlad. It's actually one of the best dictatorships in history, IMO.

I hear that organized crime has gotten much, much worse, however.
 
Definatly getting worse. Corruption up off the wahoo. Inequality. Public infastrucutre crumbling. Crime way up.
All can be said is the effect of the shock doctrine.
 
Russia is getting worse, I think. But that is to be expected.

The solution, imho, is called "decentralization". If you bare the consequences of your immediate actions you wouldn't want to cheat the people that you watch every day in the eyes in your village, town or city. However, if somebody 2000 km away decides how you should live your life, you wouldn't give a ****.
Russian bureaucracy is awful. So is the Russian state.
 
celticwar17 said:
In the Soviet Union there was killing and basically slave labor.

There's killing in every country on earth.

There wasn't slave labor in the USSR.

They have become a lot more globalized now too, instead of so secluded

The USSR wasn't secluded whatsoever. Your entire post makes no sense at all.

Jeezy said:
Economically, things are certainly much better.

For whom? The collapse of the USSR was absolutely terrible for the majority of Russian citizens.

People are free to practice their religions, which is also a good thing.

Wasn't this reinstated under Khruschev or Brezhnev or someone before the collapse? I'm not too familiar with late Soviet history.

Also, as far as I was aware, people were free to practice their religion. They just weren't free to institutionalize it. Could be wrong, though.
 
I’ve been to Russia a number of times since the fall of the USSR. It’s better in many respects and worse in other respects. Corruption, organized crime, and human trafficking are interrelated and serious problems.
 
There's killing in every country on earth.

There wasn't slave labor in the USSR.



The USSR wasn't secluded whatsoever. Your entire post makes no sense at all.
I didnt say there was slave labor, but pretty much there was under the communist state. Much like people say about the Chinese making their citizens have pretty much slave labor.

And yes they were secluded. But you do not know what i mean by secluded. They were a lot more culturally exclusive/nationalist before and now they have let up on that a good amount, letting globalization come in and expose themselves to a lot more new and different things. Before... NOTHING was coming in or out of that country!

-_- your passion for the soviet union clouds your mind enough to overlook simple statements.
 
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celticwar17 said:
I didnt say there was slave labor, but pretty much there was under the communist state. Much like people say about the Chinese making their citizens have pretty much slave labor.

There isn't "pretty much slave labor". Either there is slave labor or there is not. Slave labor is not based on a quantitative scale, it's a specific qualitative thing.

And yes they were secluded. But you do not know what i mean by secluded. They were a lot more culturally exclusive/nationalist before and now they have let up on that a good amount, letting globalization come in and expose themselves to a lot more new and different things. Before... NOTHING was coming in or out of that country!

"Seclusion" isn't based on whether or not western capital is allowed to penetrate a country.

-_- your passion for the soviet union clouds your mind enough to overlook simple statements.

What passion?
 
There isn't "pretty much slave labor". Either there is slave labor or there is not. Slave labor is not based on a quantitative scale, it's a specific qualitative thing.
No, you fail to know the use of my language. Pretty much slave labor, is working for wages that is "pretty much" nothing so it might as well be slave labor, and absolutely not enough to provide for oneself. So in terms of that, the soviet Union system was actually worse then slave labor for a lot of the population because at least slaves generally get provided food/ shelter.

"Seclusion" isn't based on whether or not western capital is allowed to penetrate a country.

It wasn't just western capital, it was cultural materials from ANYWHERE other then the communist state. Nothing was allowed to leave or enter in order to keep the population culturally brainwashed.
Even today you are not allowed to bring out Russian cultural things.
 
celticwar17 said:
No, you fail to know the use of my language. Pretty much slave labor, is working for wages that is "pretty much" nothing so it might as well be slave labor, and absolutely not enough to provide for oneself. So in terms of that, the soviet Union system was actually worse then slave labor for a lot of the population because at least slaves generally get provided food/ shelter.

Slave labor means that one is owned and does labor for their owner. One does not get a wage in slave labor. You are using emotionally charged yet meaningless rhetoric. If you want to talk about the wages in the USSR and how low they were then talk about it and cite your sources and stop using whiny emotionally charged rhetoric.

It wasn't just western capital, it was cultural materials from ANYWHERE other then the communist state. Nothing was allowed to leave or enter in order to keep the population culturally brainwashed.

Ah, so you meant globalization in the cultural sense. This is still wrong, simply because of the fact that the Soviet Union was not "isolated" even if it didn't let anything from western Europe in (which also isn't true, but let's say it is for the sake of showing how wrong you are).
 
What do you think of Russia?

Is it getting better? Or getting worse? Or is it the same as in Soviet Days.?


IMO Russia has level with the USSR. It has gotten better in economics and freeoms, but losing out in corruption and how much the government actually cares about its people.

AGREE - Consider this:
  • Who was head of the former KGB? Putin
  • Who has been Prime Minister of Russia? Putin

When you add that to the fact that a retired Hollywood actor
demanded our MAIN enemy in the Cold War
to TAKE DOWN THAT WALL .... and they did?
WHY??​

.... because we lost enough FREEDOM to merge with their political values :peace
 
Slave labor means that one is owned and does labor for their owner. One does not get a wage in slave labor. You are using emotionally charged yet meaningless rhetoric. If you want to talk about the wages in the USSR and how low they were then talk about it and cite your sources and stop using whiny emotionally charged rhetoric.



Ah, so you meant globalization in the cultural sense. This is still wrong, simply because of the fact that the Soviet Union was not "isolated" even if it didn't let anything from western Europe in (which also isn't true, but let's say it is for the sake of showing how wrong you are).

I simply disagree, i think your trying way to hard to look on the bright side of the soviet union... And i am not wrong :roll:
 
Ah, so you meant globalization in the cultural sense. This is still wrong, simply because of the fact that the Soviet Union was not "isolated" even if it didn't let anything from western Europe in (which also isn't true, but let's say it is for the sake of showing how wrong you are).
That is an opinion :roll:

Not only western Europe but also Asia, Africa, and everything except for the Slavic culture... How is that not isolating the population?

and if you dont think that was an extremely bad thing about the soviet union... your messed up.
 
Slave labor means that one is owned and does labor for their owner. One does not get a wage in slave labor. You are using emotionally charged yet meaningless rhetoric. If you want to talk about the wages in the USSR and how low they were then talk about it and cite your sources and stop using whiny emotionally charged rhetoric.
OMG... that is not even close to the POINT! it flew millions of miles past your head.

The point was the Soviet Union worked people to death with barely enough wage to provide for their needs. I can call it what i want, and i think it is near slave labor. Its just a common expression describing the immensely underpaid and forced workers.

How isnt it like slave labor when the government controls your choices and not even providing enough capital for their necessary needs, its just an indirect way of slave labor :hammer:
 
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What do you think of Russia?

Is it getting better? Or getting worse? Or is it the same as in Soviet Days.?


IMO Russia has level with the USSR. It has gotten better in economics and freeoms, but losing out in corruption and how much the government actually cares about its people.


Well, I feel like I can speak with some measure of expertise on this subject, being Russian myself. I live between the UK and Russia, now, but I've spent near on half my life (a considerable long time, I might add) in that country, and the Soviet Union.

And I'm here to say, the question of this poll is quite a loaded one. I don't know whether the Russia of now is better or worse than the Soviet Union was -- it certainly is different. But the important part of this post is to say that the Soviet Union wasn't bad. Most of you have spent your entire lives on one side of the Iron Curtain, or, for the younger members of DP, on neither side. There's so much bad press about the Soviet Union, such a loud minority of Russian emigres and dissenters, and, of course, half the world propagating this sort of thing. They say history is written by the victors, but I think it is more apt to say that what's for certain is that history is written by the survivors.

Point is, though, that the Soviet Union wasn't bad, wasn't a hellhole, wasn't an 'evil empire'. It had its problems, like the other nations of the world, but it had its glories and victories as well. And I'd bet that if you ask most of the Russians today how they felt about the Soviet Union, nostalgia would be the reigning emotion in their answers.

So, long post-short, this poll is bloody stupid, because it's heavily biased against Russia, and no-matter what is decided, Russia is going to lose out.
 
Molotok said:
But the important part of this post is to say that the Soviet Union wasn't bad.

How can you even possibly say that "work[ing] people to death with barely enough wage to provide for their needs" isn't bad?! Not to mention the fact that "everything except for the Slavic culture...was banned".

and if you dont think that was an extremely bad thing about the soviet union... your messed up.
 
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