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  • Russia is getting better

    18 58.06%
  • Level with the USSR

    8 25.81%
  • Getting worse

    5 16.13%
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Thread: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

  1. #21
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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    Slave labor means that one is owned and does labor for their owner. One does not get a wage in slave labor. You are using emotionally charged yet meaningless rhetoric. If you want to talk about the wages in the USSR and how low they were then talk about it and cite your sources and stop using whiny emotionally charged rhetoric.



    Ah, so you meant globalization in the cultural sense. This is still wrong, simply because of the fact that the Soviet Union was not "isolated" even if it didn't let anything from western Europe in (which also isn't true, but let's say it is for the sake of showing how wrong you are).
    I simply disagree, i think your trying way to hard to look on the bright side of the soviet union... And i am not wrong

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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post

    Ah, so you meant globalization in the cultural sense. This is still wrong, simply because of the fact that the Soviet Union was not "isolated" even if it didn't let anything from western Europe in (which also isn't true, but let's say it is for the sake of showing how wrong you are).
    That is an opinion

    Not only western Europe but also Asia, Africa, and everything except for the Slavic culture... How is that not isolating the population?

    and if you dont think that was an extremely bad thing about the soviet union... your messed up.

  3. #23
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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    Slave labor means that one is owned and does labor for their owner. One does not get a wage in slave labor. You are using emotionally charged yet meaningless rhetoric. If you want to talk about the wages in the USSR and how low they were then talk about it and cite your sources and stop using whiny emotionally charged rhetoric.
    OMG... that is not even close to the POINT! it flew millions of miles past your head.

    The point was the Soviet Union worked people to death with barely enough wage to provide for their needs. I can call it what i want, and i think it is near slave labor. Its just a common expression describing the immensely underpaid and forced workers.

    How isnt it like slave labor when the government controls your choices and not even providing enough capital for their necessary needs, its just an indirect way of slave labor
    Last edited by celticwar17; 06-30-11 at 03:08 PM.

  4. #24
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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Juiposa View Post
    What do you think of Russia?

    Is it getting better? Or getting worse? Or is it the same as in Soviet Days.?


    IMO Russia has level with the USSR. It has gotten better in economics and freeoms, but losing out in corruption and how much the government actually cares about its people.

    Well, I feel like I can speak with some measure of expertise on this subject, being Russian myself. I live between the UK and Russia, now, but I've spent near on half my life (a considerable long time, I might add) in that country, and the Soviet Union.

    And I'm here to say, the question of this poll is quite a loaded one. I don't know whether the Russia of now is better or worse than the Soviet Union was -- it certainly is different. But the important part of this post is to say that the Soviet Union wasn't bad. Most of you have spent your entire lives on one side of the Iron Curtain, or, for the younger members of DP, on neither side. There's so much bad press about the Soviet Union, such a loud minority of Russian emigres and dissenters, and, of course, half the world propagating this sort of thing. They say history is written by the victors, but I think it is more apt to say that what's for certain is that history is written by the survivors.

    Point is, though, that the Soviet Union wasn't bad, wasn't a hellhole, wasn't an 'evil empire'. It had its problems, like the other nations of the world, but it had its glories and victories as well. And I'd bet that if you ask most of the Russians today how they felt about the Soviet Union, nostalgia would be the reigning emotion in their answers.

    So, long post-short, this poll is bloody stupid, because it's heavily biased against Russia, and no-matter what is decided, Russia is going to lose out.

  5. #25
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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Molotok
    But the important part of this post is to say that the Soviet Union wasn't bad.
    How can you even possibly say that "work[ing] people to death with barely enough wage to provide for their needs" isn't bad?! Not to mention the fact that "everything except for the Slavic culture...was banned".

    and if you dont think that was an extremely bad thing about the soviet union... your messed up.
    "I do not claim that every incident in the history of empire can be explained in directly economic terms. Economic interests are filtered through a political process, policies are implemented by a complex state apparatus, and the whole system generates its own momentum."

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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    How can you even possibly say that "work[ing] people to death with barely enough wage to provide for their needs" isn't bad?! Not to mention the fact that "everything except for the Slavic culture...was banned".

    and if you dont think that was an extremely bad thing about the soviet union... your messed up.
    I don't know of anyone worked to death trying to get a wage to provide for their needs. Why? Because the Soviet Union was filled with just the opposite. The state provided everyone with an apartment, a car, some food and some vodka, clothes when you needed 'em, and a lovely month off in the summer. Were they of the finest quality that a person could own at that time? No, of course not. In general, it was all of a very mediocre quality. But everyone had it. EVERYONE. No one was working themselves to death to get some bread -- in the Soviet Union, the idea wouldn't have even crossed our thoughts. We would get out bread, whether or not we worked hard. Working hard didn't have an effect on the amount of vodka we got. THAT is the oft-maligned reality of the Soviet Union -- hard work was not always rewarded as perhaps it ought to have been.

    But do not come to me and say that people were slaving away in factories and farms for a scrap of bread. That's not how it was.

  7. #27
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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeezy View Post
    Pfft. Don't whine because your bitch-control game was weak.


    EDIT: Wow...it didn't censor that.
    The only words that are censored are ****, ****, and ****.

    Edit: my bad, the f-word, the s-word, and the c-word.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    How can you even possibly say that "work[ing] people to death with barely enough wage to provide for their needs" isn't bad?! Not to mention the fact that "everything except for the Slavic culture...was banned".

    and if you dont think that was an extremely bad thing about the soviet union... your messed up.
    Quote Originally Posted by Molotok View Post
    I don't know of anyone worked to death trying to get a wage to provide for their needs. Why? Because the Soviet Union was filled with just the opposite. The state provided everyone with an apartment, a car, some food and some vodka, clothes when you needed 'em, and a lovely month off in the summer. Were they of the finest quality that a person could own at that time? No, of course not. In general, it was all of a very mediocre quality. But everyone had it. EVERYONE. No one was working themselves to death to get some bread -- in the Soviet Union, the idea wouldn't have even crossed our thoughts. We would get out bread, whether or not we worked hard. Working hard didn't have an effect on the amount of vodka we got. THAT is the oft-maligned reality of the Soviet Union -- hard work was not always rewarded as perhaps it ought to have been.

    But do not come to me and say that people were slaving away in factories and farms for a scrap of bread. That's not how it was.
    Oh goodie, epic commie showdown!
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  9. #29
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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Oh goodie, epic commie showdown!
    Ahaha. Actually, I'm not a communist. I'm just a liberal-democratic socialist, I work with the Labour party here in Britain. I keep the Hammer and Sickle as my avatar for my heritage.

  10. #30
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    Re: Is Russia just as bad as the Soviet Union?

    Quote Originally Posted by Molotok View Post
    Ahaha. Actually, I'm not a communist. I'm just a liberal-democratic socialist, I work with the Labour party here in Britain. I keep the Hammer and Sickle as my avatar for my heritage.
    what part of your heritage?
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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