View Poll Results: Is the use of the autopen to sign bills Constitutional?

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  • Yes, it is

    10 35.71%
  • No, and it bothers me that Obama used it

    12 42.86%
  • No, but Obama's use of it doesn't really bother me

    2 7.14%
  • Don't know/don't care

    4 14.29%
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Thread: Presidential use of the autopen

  1. #21
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    article

    Article 1 Section 7 Clause 2



    To me, it can't be Constitutional. The Constitution clearly states that a bill must be signed by the president, not an Autopen. I don't even know if an Autopen would constitute a legal signature for contracts, though perhaps someone on here can clarify that use.
    It is a clear violation of the constitution because it says the president must sign it if he approves of it. A auto-pen is not the president and the auto-pen was not elected to office to sign the bills and it doesn't matter if who authorized the auto pen because it blatantly violates the constitution seeing how it says the president must sign it if he approves of the bill, it does not say he can delegate this authority to anyone or something else. It doesn't matter if other presidents did this before(I do not know if they did nor have I read the whole thread), it is still wrong. It doesn't matter if he originally intends to sign the bill because politicians are scum and they will take advantage of the autopen by sneaking in unrelated **** into the bill. Its bad enough we have some politicians who do not read the bills before voting yes for them we do not need politicians not signing the bills.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  2. #22
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    I see this as a non-issue, he should have simply resigned it on his return.

  3. #23
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Yeah, let's waste time and non-existent money on a lawsuit over autopen.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


  4. #24
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    Yeah, let's waste time and non-existent money on a lawsuit over autopen.
    There is no worry that congress or senate could take advantage of the fact the president is not signing the bill?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  5. #25
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    There is no worry that congress or senate could take advantage of the fact the president is not signing the bill?
    He's giving authorization to approve bills that the House and Senate have already voted on. As another poster mentioned, the likelihood that either house or the president are actually reading these bills in their entirety is pretty much non-existent. If we want to solve the problem we need to go to the root of it. Fixating on autopen is silly.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


  6. #26
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Quote Originally Posted by tessaesque View Post
    He's giving authorization to approve bills that the House and Senate have already voted on.

    You do not think the house and senate would sneak in something or allow something to be sneaked it?

    As another poster mentioned, the likelihood that either house or the president are actually reading these bills in their entirety is pretty much non-existent.
    Which is why its even a bigger deal of the president NOT SIGNING THE BILL HIMSELF.

    If we want to solve the problem we need to go to the root of it. Fixating on autopen is silly.
    The autopen is a blatant violation of the constitution so what is silly is playing off this autopen as no big deal.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  7. #27
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    I don't get the upset. Its not like 'Autopen' has taken a life of its own and is signing executive orders on its own. The President approved of and signed for the legislation. He is directly responsible for the signature, regardless of whether or not he signed it in person or from Europe.

  8. #28
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    There is no worry that congress or senate could take advantage of the fact the president is not signing the bill?
    Its not like they read the things anyway. They could sneak in just as much today. Im certain there is a team of lawyers reviewing the legislation before the president signs it...its not like he is a congressman 'just' voting.

  9. #29
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    You do not think the house and senate would sneak in something or allow something to be sneaked it?


    Which is why its even a bigger deal of the president NOT SIGNING THE BILL HIMSELF.



    The autopen is a blatant violation of the constitution so what is silly is playing off this autopen as no big deal.
    It isn't a big deal. Whether he signs it personally or not, it isn't being read. Crap is snuck into almost every bill that lands on the president's desk. Pelosi and other reps have freely admitted to not reading bills prior to voting on them. I can't say it's "clearly" a violation of the constitution. Autopen didn't exist in 1778.
    "Hmmm...Can't decide if I want to watch "Four Houses" or give myself an Icy Hot pee hole enema..." - Blake Shelton


  10. #30
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    Re: Presidential use of the autopen

    Quote Originally Posted by VanceMack View Post
    I don't get the upset. Its not like 'Autopen' has taken a life of its own and is signing executive orders on its own. The President approved of and signed for the legislation. He is directly responsible for the signature, regardless of whether or not he signed it in person or from Europe.
    Yeah - I'm leaning in this direction.

    It is his will - it's also his signature (the autopen doesn't do it on it's own - it's programmed, with permission, based on the president's decision). If he didn't approve of the autopen then he wouldn't be using it - and *then* it wouldn't be acceptable if someone used it regardless.

    You know - what if he was in an accident or ill and unable to use his hands and sign - I think the autopen would be accepted in that situation ,wouldn't it?
    A screaming comes across the sky.
    It has happened before, but there is nothing to compare it to now.
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