View Poll Results: What if a Minister refuses to perform gay ceremony?

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  • Should be allowed to refuse.

    92 98.92%
  • Should be forced to perform.

    0 0%
  • Should be stripped of license.

    1 1.08%
  • Should be arrested.

    0 0%
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Thread: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

  1. #131
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Does this mean it happened 11 years ago?

    Mon 21 Aug 00 18:31
    Anything more recent?

    Oh. There is:

    Earlier this month it was reported that a justice of the peace in Louisiana refused to perform the wedding of an interracial couple. Justice Keith Bardwell claimed he was not a racist, having married black couples in his own home, but explained that he declined all interracial marriages out of concern for the children of such unions. He voiced the belief that the children of interracial couples have a difficult time in life.
    Note that Bardwell is not a man of the cloth, but a JP.

    Yes, it's bull****. Both were wrong. In my experience, children of black-white marriages are freakin gorgeous.

  2. #132
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    Quote Originally Posted by LuckyDan View Post
    Does this mean it happened 11 years ago?



    Anything more recent?

    Oh. There is:



    Note that Bardwell is not a man of the cloth, but a JP.

    Yes, it's bull****. Both were wrong. In my experience, children of black-white marriages are freakin gorgeous.
    I personally have zero issue with interracial marriages. I dated a black guy in high school, an Indian guy in A-school, and a full Mexican and a half-Mexican (good looking guy) on the ship. I also had 4 mixed second cousins (the oldest drowned 1 year and 1/2 ago).

    What we personally find to be acceptable or not and what is the law are two different things however. According to the law, it is completely legal for a church to refuse to marry a couple for any reason they want, including race, religion, age, sex, sexuality, length of relationship, previous marriages, etc. A clergy could refuse to marry a couple just because he/she doesn't like one or both of the pair. It is a religious ceremony. There is always someone else who can marry a couple. And most couples would rather have someone who actually does approve of their relationship, than someone who is being forced to preside over their union because of a law.

    I am completely against any clergy being forced to wed any couple that he/she does not want to wed, gay, straight, white, black, whoever.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  3. #133
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, they will not be forced by law in the future.
    no, they will simply lose their licenses if they do not.

  4. #134
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    And that's the concern, I think.
    well, and it is warranted - we are already seeing moves in this direction.

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    the first amendment will not be changing in the future because of equal gay rights.
    leaving aside the dispute over what you call "equal gay rights" - the first amendment absolutely will have it's enforcement changed over this issue in the future. already we have seen that the right to association (which is part of the first amendment) can fall before the homosexual demand for Acceptance. Dating sites are forced to match homosexual couples, and pushes abroad to force Christian adoption agencies to treat homosexual couples the same as heterosexual married couples have given rise to similar movements here.

    marriage will be declared to be a state function (which it already is), and it will be argued that those entrusted with carrying out state duties are not allowed to discriminate. Ministers and churches will be told to either start marrying homosexual couples, or lose their ability to officially wed people at all. You start with adoption, then with employment, and you work your way up; and slowly the church's right of association falls before the demands of the Accept Me crowd. We still have all of the "Civil Rights" organizations decades after they have achieved the changes in law that they were founded to effect. Do you think that the homosexual advocacy movement will disappear simply because they succeed in having some states marry them? No, their organizations will continue to exist, and they will be in need of new justifications for their activism.

    Everyone now votes in favor of option #1. I am reminded of someone swearing up and down that if the Civil Rights Act led to racial quota's, he would eat his hat.
    Last edited by cpwill; 06-27-11 at 08:39 AM.

  5. #135
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post

    leaving aside the dispute over what you call "equal gay rights" - the first amendment absolutely will have it's enforcement changed over this issue in the future. already we have seen that the right to association (which is part of the first amendment) can fall before the homosexual demand for Acceptance. Dating sites are forced to match homosexual couples, and pushes abroad to force Christian adoption agencies to treat homosexual couples the same as heterosexual married couples have given rise to similar movements here.

    marriage will be declared to be a state function (which it already is), and it will be argued that those entrusted with carrying out state duties are not allowed to discriminate. You start with adoption, then with employment, and you work your way up; and slowly the church's right of association falls before the demands of the Accept Me crowd. We still have all of the "Civil Rights" organizations decades after they have achieved the changes in law that they were founded to effect. Do you think that the homosexual advocacy movement will disappear simply because they succeed in having some states marry them? No, their organizations will continue to exist, and they will be in need of new justifications for their activism. Ministers and churches will be told to either start marrying homosexual couples, or lose their ability to officially wed people at all.
    And the law will rule in the Churches favor.
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  6. #136
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    sadly (or not) no, it won't. the law has already ruled that Christian Organizations do not have the right to association when it comes to deciding to exclude homosexuals; and when it comes to their churches performing state duties? what does the minister say? "By the power invested in my by the state of New York...." yeah, that law will turn quick.

    and the people here and now swearing up and down that they would oppose such a measure will be defending it.

  7. #137
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    sadly (or not) no, it won't. the law has already ruled that Christian Organizations do not have the right to association when it comes to deciding to exclude homosexuals; and when it comes to their churches performing state duties? that law will turn quick.

    and the people here and now swearing up and down that they would oppose such a measure will be defending it.
    A church preforming a marriage ceremony is a religious ceremony, and the first amendment protects them.
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  8. #138
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    no doubt they will be allowed to continue to have religious ceremonies. they will simply lose the ability to perform legally binding ones.

  9. #139
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    no doubt they will be allowed to continue to have religious ceremonies. they will simply lose the ability to perform legally binding ones.
    Highly doubtful, this whole line of questioning is nothing more than a scare tactic used by people who want to delay the inevitable.
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  10. #140
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    Re: What if a Minister refuses to perform a gay wedding ceremony?

    and the inevitable is that churches will face the choice between either marrying homosexuals, or losing their license. It's not a scare tactic - it's simply the direction of travel.

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