Thread: Is Reckless Driving (Misdemeanor) charge for 20 miles over the speed limit excessive?

Originally Posted by Risky Thicket

In Arizona it's called "criminal speeding". I have a heavy foot. I've been stopped twice for that. Once in Ajo driving back from a week in Mexico. Many roads in Arizona beg you to speed. The Interstate is often 75 mph, the police generally spot you 10 mph. If you get caught doing 20 over you deserve it. In Arizona criminal speeding (20+ mph over the speed limit) authorizes the cop to handcuff your butt and take you to jail. In Glendale, Az it is mandatory that you are arrested if a cop stops you for criminal speeding.

I was most fortunate in Ajo to have a good cop who advised me to come back and face the judge. I returned on the scheduled date and went before the judge in Ajo. This wasn't my first time in traffic court. Like I said, I have a heavy foot. Never have I met a judge like this guy. He put it in a perspective I've never seen nor heard of. He was a hell of a guy. He agreed to wipe my record clean after I provided the court proof of having gone through traffic school. I have never, I will never, speed in or around Ajo again. Such is the respect that I have for the judge and the people of Ajo who elected him. I gave him my word that I wouldn't speed there and I gave him my word that I would come back and spend some time in Ajo and enjoy the town and its history and its people. I have on several occasions - and driving the speed limit the entire time.

Absolutely, you were fortunate. You could have definitely been handcuffed, sent to jail, and faced high criminal charges. Certain employers, especially in government, will fire you immediately with that kind of record. Others won't even hire you or even consider interviewing you. To me, a misdemeanor is something that has the capability to ruin lives, permanently and therefore should only be issued for serious crimes. I again state that for the rest of America, 15 or 20 over the limit is just speeding. It warrants an infraction and a fine, at best. But to permanently hurt someone's record so their employment opportunities are hindered in the future, all for doing 15 or 20 over the limit, is outrageous.

Originally Posted by ElijahGalt

As I said above, going 15 or 20 miles over the speed limit will usually get you a speeding ticket. For the vast majority of America, 15 or 20 miles over the speed limit will mean an infraction and in the worst case scenario, an expensive ticket. But to up the ante and to make what normally constitutes speeding a misdemeanor means that the state of Virginia is turning ordinary, law-abiding citizens into cop-hating criminals.

If you do not want to be charged with a misdemeanor then do not speed 15-20 miles over the speed limit. You do not have the right to drive nor do you have the right to drive as fast as you want.

For the rest of America, 15 or 20 over is called speeding. In Virginia, it's called reckless driving.

Do you have links to back up this claim?

Have YOU ever gone over the speed limit? Have you ever received a speeding ticket? If you have, it'll be interesting to discover how fast you were going.

How is this relevant?

Again, it's the norm in America to issue a speeding ticket for 15 or 20 over, but a permanent criminal record that could easily affect your chances of future employment is not reasonable. It is excessive.

Its excessive to drive 15-20 miles over the speed limit.Your speeding endangers those who are actually obeying the traffic laws.

Sounds like someone got a ticket and doesn't want to pay.

Originally Posted by jamesrage

If you do not want to be charged with a misdemeanor then do not speed 15-20 miles over the speed limit. You do not have the right to drive nor do you have the right to drive as fast as you want.

Who decides when, where, and what I'm allowed to drive? You? The government? That is correct, but it is actually a separate debate. I do not believe that physically driving a car is an absolute privilege granted by a higher government. The government has monopolized nearly the entire roadway system of America. Individuals have no choice but to bow to the will of government. But frankly, driving a motor vehicle, like operating any other technological equipment, should not be viewed as a government privilege.

Yes, we do not have the right in this country to drive as fast as we want. But nearly 95% of the U.S. population would admit to speeding at one time in their life. Most people, at least every single individual I know with the exception of the elderly, will go over the legal limit at least 5 mph, usually it's 10. Most people will tell you that ten miles over the limit is generally safe and few cops will pull you over for ten miles. Anything more than ten miles, and you could definitely be pulled over and cited. Depending on where you live, you can drive 15 mph over the limit and still be fine. That is true for many parts of California, and Binary_Digit may have been accurate when he said it will depend on the conditions of the highway, itself.

But in Virginia, 15 mph over the limit (what many Americans are even comfortable driving) can be considered reckless. 20 mph is a mandatory reckless with a misdemeanor. I guess most of the people who voted on this poll don't realize how often Americans speed and how incredibly harmful a misdemeanor conviction could mean in the future. This country is already filled with overcrowded prisons, excessive laws, and an unemployed population. Why create more prisoners and more unemployed people for violations that should come with just an infraction?

Do you have links to back up this claim?

Reckless driving - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A better question would be, can you list the states in the greater U.S.A. whose mandatory provisions require a reckless driving misdemeanor charge for a flat 20-over-the-limit. Since it would be fruitless for myself to prove a negative, the burden of proof is on you to prove that Virginia is not the only one. I'm sure there are probably a few other states, and I think (according to Risky Thicket), Arizona is probably one of them. But as I said, for the vast majority of America, 20-over-the-limit without accident or injury is an infraction with probably an expensive ticket.

How is this relevant?

It is certainly relevant that if you believe going 15 or 20 miles over the limit would warrant a misdemeanor reckless conviction, then we should examine your own driving record. Of course, if you have a perfectly clean record and swear to all that is holy that you never go beyond the legal limit, then it becomes irrelevant. It would be like arguing against alcohol prohibition to a woman of the temperance movement.

Its excessive to drive 15-20 miles over the speed limit.Your speeding endangers those who are actually obeying the traffic laws.

The question is not about the excessive behavior of going 15 or 20 miles over the speed. With only a few minor exceptions, the majority of America would agree that 20 miles over the limit is excessive and should be faced with penalty. 15 would be a little bit more debatable and it would definitely depend on circumstances. But only a handful of state governments actually wish to turn ordinary speeding tickets into misdemeanors and mandatory sentences.

Originally Posted by ksu_aviator

Sounds like someone got a ticket and doesn't want to pay.

It's not just a ticket. For the third time now, it is not the question of this OP whether or not 20 miles over the limit is excessive but whether or not the mandatory misdemeanor charge in VA is excessive. I'm not going to argue that going 20 over the limit is right and without danger. Of course it isn't. But most of America believes (and I strongly agree) that only an infraction and perhaps a heavy fine will suffice. We don't need to ruin people's lives with a criminal record.

And I didn't get the charge, my wife did. And though you probably don't care or won't believe it, we both feel she is innocent of the charge. We were in Northern Virginia visiting folk and not more than 1000 feet from the exit of the Dulles access road toll booth, my wife is pulled over and cited for going 80/55. It wasn't like we were driving a corvette that could maybe get to 80 mph in a matter of a 1000 feet. It was just a used Toyota Corolla. My wife is a permanent resident and this charge will not help her application for citizenship.

Originally Posted by ElijahGalt

It is certainly relevant that if you believe going 15 or 20 miles over the limit would warrant a misdemeanor reckless conviction, then we should examine your own driving record. Of course, if you have a perfectly clean record and swear to all that is holy that you never go beyond the legal limit, then it becomes irrelevant. It would be like arguing against alcohol prohibition to a woman of the temperance movement.

Whether or not I have engaged in speeding, drag racing or other reckless things in the past has nothing to with the fact that I view such actions as reckless. A mature adult knows these actions reckless regardless if they done these things and got in trouble for them or not.

Originally Posted by jamesrage

Whether or not I have engaged in speeding, drag racing or other reckless things in the past has nothing to with the fact that I view such actions as reckless. A mature adult knows these actions reckless regardless if they done these things and got in trouble for them or not.

Read the rest of my post and respond to other, more important points. Frankly, I don't care what you've done in the past. The greater point is that Americans speed all the time and something like 15 or 20 is the usual going rate for an infraction. To make it a misdemeanor is excessive and counter-productive.

Originally Posted by ElijahGalt

It's not just a ticket. For the third time now, it is not the question of this OP whether or not 20 miles over the limit is excessive but whether or not the mandatory misdemeanor charge in VA is excessive. I'm not going to argue that going 20 over the limit is right and without danger. Of course it isn't. But most of America believes (and I strongly agree) that only an infraction and perhaps a heavy fine will suffice. We don't need to ruin people's lives with a criminal record.

And I didn't get the charge, my wife did. And though you probably don't care or won't believe it, we both feel she is innocent of the charge. We were in Northern Virginia visiting folk and not more than 1000 feet from the exit of the Dulles access road toll booth, my wife is pulled over and cited for going 80/55. It wasn't like we were driving a corvette that could maybe get to 80 mph in a matter of a 1000 feet. It was just a used Toyota Corolla. My wife is a permanent resident and this charge will not help her application for citizenship.

It is not excessive. People just need to take responsibility for their actions.

Originally Posted by ElijahGalt

I thought you were a police officer. Any ticket is NOT a misdemeanor. The vast majority of traffic tickets are called INFRACTIONS.

I was, and in my state ALL tickets are misdemeanors. I will admit that I do not know whether this is the case in EVERY state of the union, but it most definitely is in mine.


Dammit, now I've got to find out whether other states consider tickets misdemeanors, since you're making a big ass deal out of it.

Okay, apparently tickets are classified differently by different states. What a shock, huh.

One lawyer says that as a general principle all speeding tickets are misdemeanors. Other sources say otherwise.

So far, New Jersey yes, Texas and Michigan no (civil infractions).

Apparently we were both over-generalizing.

Virginia has four classes of misdemeanors, with Class 1 and Class 2 misdemeanors being punishable by twelve-month and six-month jail sentences, respectively, and Class 3 and Class 4 misdemeanors being non-jail offenses payable by fines.

Apparently Virginia is harsher than most in terms of speeding tickets...

LYNCHBURG VIRGINIA TRAFFIC TICKET DEFENSE

The SRIS Law Group

You are driving down the road in Lynchburg, Virginia and the next thing you see is flashing lights in your rear view mirror.

Great! What joy?

At best, you are going to get a Virginia speeding ticket or some other form of Virginia traffic violation.

Worst case scenario, you are going to be charged with a crime that masquerades as a traffic ticket.
You may be asking, what kind of crime could you be charged with in Lynchburg Virginia for just driving down the road?

Here are the possible criminal charges you could be facing in Lynchburg Virginia:

Virginia Reckless Driving Ticket
Virginia Driving On Suspended License Ticket
Virginia Aggressive Driving Ticket
So what is the big deal with any of the above traffic tickets? After all they are just Virginia traffic tickets right?

Wrong. The above tickets are misdemeanors in Virginia.

What is a misdemeanor ticket in Virginia? A misdemeanor ticket in Virginia may land you in jail and cause you to lose your license.