View Poll Results: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5?

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Thread: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rights?

  1. #31
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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Misterveritis View Post
    Don't get sucked in. Does anyone want to bet there is a provision in the declaration that says everyone has a right to all kinds of goodies, and that the rich should pay for them? In this case the rich meaning the United States, of course.

    Pffft. We need to get the United Nations out of the United States. And then we need to get the US out of the UN.
    Why don't you either read the other 25 articles, or assess them as they get posted over the next five weeks...
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  2. #32
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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    This is irrelevant to me, anyway. I'm opposed to the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
    Why? It is actually a pretty good outline of what basic rights should be and it is pretty widely accepted. You know the U.S. had a strong hand in its drafting and passage, don't you?
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  3. #33
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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    Regarding homosexuals again, there are other organizations like the Boy Scouts for example which officially do not allow atheist or homosexual members yet they receive Federal Funding. Now I suppose if its a private group they can do as they please, but receiving Federal funding for discrimination irks me. Now since its a fairly decentralized organization, so its not like every chapter is the same. And to my shame I don't have a source, I found one but now I can't locate it again, so if you disbelief that I wouldn't blame you.

    As for the criminal justice system, do you have any data on UK vs US crime rates? And kudos for the support of legalization of some drugs.
    I don't think the relatively few and minor homosexual rights issues are enough to kick up that big of a fuss over, but opinions vary and I know you are sincere.

    Yes, I have data on the Uk and US crime rates. It was quite a shocker for many people to find out that the UK is overall more violent than the US, at least by statistical comparison.

    Violent crime in UK now higher than in the US - News - The Independent

    The most violent country in Europe: Britain is also worse than South Africa and U.S. | Mail Online

    UK Is Violent Crime Capital of Europe :: American Renaissance News

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  4. #34
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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics there are approximately 70,000 reported prison rapes annually. And that's just the ones that are reported. Many people just want to serve their time and be left alone, not everyone is trying to "make their own hell." And the ones who do should be isolated from other prisoners.



    But far fewer than what deal with OUR unjust system.



    Far fewer than what deal with OUR unjust system.



    Far fewer than what deal with OUR unjust system.



    I'm not saying that we should look to these regimes as a model of human rights...but it's hard to claim any sort of moral high ground over them when our own criminal justice system is among the most barbaric in the world. I find it incredibly naive when people gasp in horror at the thought of Saudi police cutting off someone's hand for, say, stealing a car...yet you can receive a far worse penalty than that in the American justice system, such as being raped daily and locked in a cage for the rest of your life. The main difference is that we incarcerate a lot MORE people than those countries we look down on for their human rights records.

    All I can say is you quite amaze me, with your apples and oranges..... or firecrackers and nuclear bombs comparisons. I don't disagree that our prison system and justice system need reform, but to compare them to Iran, China and Saudi with a straight face is just.... remarkable.

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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    Why don't you either read the other 25 articles, or assess them as they get posted over the next five weeks...
    It is the United Nations. There is no need to go any further.

  6. #36
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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by ludahai View Post
    Why? It is actually a pretty good outline of what basic rights should be and it is pretty widely accepted. You know the U.S. had a strong hand in its drafting and passage, don't you?
    It's based on a fundamentally flawed-- and dangerous-- moral premise, that all human beings are created equal. This belief has caused many problems over the past couple centuries.

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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    It's based on a fundamentally flawed-- and dangerous-- moral premise, that all human beings are created equal. This belief has caused many problems over the past couple centuries.
    Perhaps you are confusing the very reasonable "equal before the law" versus equality of outcomes in life. The first is fair and just. The second is not.

  8. #38
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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    All I can say is you quite amaze me, with your apples and oranges..... or firecrackers and nuclear bombs comparisons. I don't disagree that our prison system and justice system need reform, but to compare them to Iran, China and Saudi with a straight face is just.... remarkable.
    OK, well let's suppose that you were convicted of grand theft auto. If you were given a choice, which would you pick for your punishment? A) Having your non-dominant hand cut off by a Saudi cop, B) Being locked in a cage for the rest of your life and raped daily in a California prison.

    I'd certainly rather pick (A). And yes, those ARE plausible sentences in each of those jurisdictions, especially if it isn't someone's first offense. The US criminal justice system has NO moral high ground over almost anyone in the world when it comes to human rights abuses. It is horrid.
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  9. #39
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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    OK, well let's suppose that you were convicted of grand theft auto.
    Highly improbable, as I am not a thief. Hint for avoiding imprisonment: don't steal **** that ain't yours.

    If you were given a choice, which would you pick for your punishment? A) Having your non-dominant hand cut off by a Saudi cop, B) Being locked in a cage for the rest of your life and raped daily in a California prison.
    The latter is not a realistic expression of what would happen to you in America. You would not be given life imprisonment, unless this was your third related felony. Being raped daily while in prison is possible but hardly an absolute or part of the sentence. It will depend on many factors, not least of which is what prison you are sent to, which in part depends on your behavior. Behave yourself and you could be a in a well-ordered low-sec prison where violence is rare; act like an ass and you could end up in a hi-sec with the worst of the worst and yeah, you might end up someone's bitch if you're not tough enough.

    Could we/should we do a better job of keeping prison inmates safe inside? Sure. Is it as bad as you're portraying? Not nearly. Also, when you lock the worst scum up together, as I say, they tend to make their own hell because that's how they are...






    I'd certainly rather pick (A). And yes, those ARE plausible sentences in each of those jurisdictions, especially if it isn't someone's first offense. The US criminal justice system has NO moral high ground over almost anyone in the world when it comes to human rights abuses. It is horrid.
    Bah. You're overstating this matter by several orders of magnitude.

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    Re: How does your country stand up on Articles 1-5 of the Universal Dec. of Human Rig

    Quote Originally Posted by Viktyr Korimir View Post
    It's based on a fundamentally flawed-- and dangerous-- moral premise, that all human beings are created equal. This belief has caused many problems over the past couple centuries.
    It does keep people nice and deluded though, while the powers that be get the real work done.

    Sad, but true.

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