View Poll Results: has self defence gone too far in this instance?

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  • The defendant was guilty but should not have been imprisoned.

    3 7.89%
  • Defendant should be found innocent

    31 81.58%
  • Defendant was guilty and prison was the right result

    3 7.89%
  • Other

    1 2.63%
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Thread: When does self-defence go too far?

  1. #61
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    This is exactly what I'm getting at. That's all there is to effectively using a firearm, sure, but it's not necessarily the case that that's what would happen if you attempted to use a firearm while assaulted. It might get knocked out of your hand before you get a chance to fire, you might fire, but miss, and inadvertently shoot someone walking down the street outside of your house, etc. My point is simply that there are risks involved that might create extremely bad results. I'm not suggesting that these risks necessarily outweigh the potential self-defense benefits of carrying (or at least owning) a firearm, but they do merit some serious thought.
    Points well taken. Hopefully anyone who elects to own a firearm will take the proper training to know how and when to use it. Further, I would hope that firearm owners would practice often. Lastly, I would hope that gun slinging criminals all learn to shoot weapons from watching dumbass TV and movies, that gives the rest of us a hell of an edge should we ever find ourselves in a gunfight defending what is ours.










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  2. #62
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aderleth View Post
    This is exactly what I'm getting at. That's all there is to effectively using a firearm, sure, but it's not necessarily the case that that's what would happen if you attempted to use a firearm while assaulted. It might get knocked out of your hand before you get a chance to fire, you might fire, but miss, and inadvertently shoot someone walking down the street outside of your house, etc. My point is simply that there are risks involved that might create extremely bad results. I'm not suggesting that these risks necessarily outweigh the potential self-defense benefits of carrying (or at least owning) a firearm, but they do merit some serious thought.
    Let me turn that back on you and say if you go for someone's weapon you'll likely get shot before you can reach it.

    Risks indeed, the vic isn't the only one in danger

    It doesn't take more than a couple hours to become 'trained and knowledgeable' on most personal firearms.

    I'd like to add that your concerns are what the typical gun buyer is thinking about when they're shopping and talking shop in the store. My snub-noes has a range of a few hundred feet, and the round I use won't penetrate your typical household wall unless you put the gun right up against it; and even then the round will brake apart as it passes though. My weapon of choice is only good for short, very close range shooting, like someone just busted down your door. My weapon is no good in a firefight.
    Last edited by Jerry; 06-23-11 at 09:14 PM.

  3. #63
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by Risky Thicket View Post
    Points well taken. Hopefully anyone who elects to own a firearm will take the proper training to know how and when to use it. Further, I would hope that firearm owners would practice often. Lastly, I would hope that gun slinging criminals all learn to shoot weapons from watching dumbass TV and movies, that gives the rest of us a hell of an edge should we ever find ourselves in a gunfight defending what is ours.
    point taken
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  4. #64
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite Chaos View Post
    Here's a story making local headlines in my region.


    Personally, I think 6 guys going round to another man's house get what they deserve if they underestimate the victim's ability to defend himself and I also think the 5 year jail sentence served on Bowman was a joke.

    I agree entirely. You break into a man's house as an armed mob, you deserve what you get. A faceful of buckshot sounds about right.

    With that said, there is a point beyond which, legally, you have to stop: when someone clearly ceases to be a threat, runs away, falls down begging for mercy, etc.

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  5. #65
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    With that said, there is a point beyond which, legally, you have to stop: when someone clearly ceases to be a threat, runs away, falls down begging for mercy, etc.
    I'd still shoot them, even if they were begging for mercy. I'm not going to take the risk that they were faking or that they will have a change of heart when they have already showed the intention to kill me or my family.
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  6. #66
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    point taken
    Back in the early days of IPSC many "standards" had a "weak hand" stage and many people found it was faster to tilt the gun sideways so your dominant eye would line up with the sights (as opposed to shutting your dominant eye and shooting with your weak eye). we also found that shooting weakhand you got a bit more control turning the gun at a 45 degree angle towards the middle of your body. Maybe that is where these mopes got this idea. And yes I hope all the scumbags try to shoot that way when up against the people I have trained

  7. #67
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Technically one of the options is an error

    You are not found INNOCENT. you are acquitted or found not guilty meaning the state was not able to overcome your presumption of innocence

  8. #68
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gargantuan View Post
    Self defense goes too far in a lot of cases. In this one, I really don't think it did. But when, for example, you have an unarmed burglar who posed no threat to the resident entering a house being shot and killed, that is simply too far. Most states now have amended castle doctrines to allow manslaughter charges for people who go too far in self defense.
    Wrong. More and more states are strengthening castle law. Also, how do you know the burglar is unarmed and means you no harm? (other than wanting to steal things you worked hard for...)

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  9. #69
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by scourge99 View Post
    I'd still shoot them, even if they were begging for mercy. I'm not going to take the risk that they were faking or that they will have a change of heart when they have already showed the intention to kill me or my family.
    I personally don't have a problem with that... just bear in mind the law may think otherwise.

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  10. #70
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    Re: When does self-defence go too far?

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    I personally don't have a problem with that... just bear in mind the law may think otherwise.
    we teach our students to keep firing until the threat is over. and that can mean multiple targets or one

    obviously if three mopes are trying to do you in you want to put rounds on the most dangerous right away and then rounds on the others and come back and make sure none are still a viable threat.

    I was asked why i only used one of the 13 rounds I have available (Smith 469 second generation 9mm) when I was mugged easy answer, the mope I hit went down and the other mope ran away. threat over-no need to shoot any more

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