View Poll Results: Who was right: North or South?

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  • North

    39 58.21%
  • South

    21 31.34%
  • Neither

    7 10.45%
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Thread: The Civil War

  1. #61
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Umm no. The "right to abolish it itself" is really the "right to dither for a few more decades while human beings remained enslaved." No state has that right. Just like if one of our state governments decided to become totalitarian and start murdering its residents, you damn well believe the federal government would militarily intervene rather than respecting the states' "right" to sort the matter out for itself.
    If the Noth could threaten the states with military intervention over slavery, then it would create a president for them to threaten military intervention over anything. The Constitution makes deployment of the United States military in the states illegal. You don't get to throw the law aside when it doesn't suit your agenda.

  2. #62
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    OK so bad things happened up North as well. That makes it all right.
    Just putting things into historical perspective, my man. Going along with your, "****'em", school of thought.

  3. #63
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    There are people that would say the same thing about owning a dog, or a horse. In fact, there are members of the current administration that want to give animals the same rights as humans, which could eventually make animal ownership illegal. When you consider that fact, it's not a far stretch for Southerners to fear for their property rights.
    Umm, what? Are you seriously comparing owning human beings to owning a horse? Or are you saying that the southerners seceded to prevent the animal rights movement 150 years later?

    I have no idea what point you're trying to make here.
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by DrunkenAsparagus View Post
    They seized many government buildings and property. They never compensated the North.
    What would be the compensation? Money? If I recall it wasn't that easy. They wanted the forts, and the land it was on as compensation if I recall. Not an easy order for a nation that was being formed that no way to have a military or protections, specially if part of the deal is losing the land as well. If I am to allow the land to be of a different country that allows them to be in a situation where they are inside my country, a situation I have no interest to agree with. Would you actually agree with what they wanted if you were the south?

  5. #65
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    If the Noth could threaten the states with military intervention over slavery, then it would create a president for them to threaten military intervention over anything.
    Not anything, just flagrant abuses of the Constitution (not to mention basic human rights) with belligerent state governments unwilling to yield.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst
    The Constitution makes deployment of the United States military in the states illegal.
    No it doesn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst
    You don't get to throw the law aside when it doesn't suit your agenda.
    Like the part in the Constitution about the federal government guaranteeing all states a republican form of government?
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  6. #66
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    When they left in peace, and meant no harm to another, and when the nation was formed out of willing members I see no reason for violence. The only reason the north could manage was government property, and that was a weak one.
    The South leaving in "peace" is revisionist crap. The south attacked and seized US federal property, an act of war. Also, secession was illegal, anyway. Texas v. White confirned this as did Federalist 7.

    Oh... and I wold certainly be on the side of the North.
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  7. #67
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Umm, what? Are you seriously comparing owning human beings to owning a horse? Or are you saying that the southerners seceded to prevent the animal rights movement 150 years later?

    I have no idea what point you're trying to make here.
    You made that clear when the only argument you could muster was to put words into my mouth. What's next? You gonna call me a racist/homophobe?

  8. #68
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    What would be the compensation? Money? If I recall it wasn't that easy. They wanted the forts, and the land it was on as compensation if I recall. Not an easy order for a nation that was being formed that no way to have a military or protections, specially if part of the deal is losing the land as well. If I am to allow the land to be of a different country that allows them to be in a situation where they are inside my country, a situation I have no interest to agree with. Would you actually agree with what they wanted if you were the south?
    They could have worked something out.
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  9. #69
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by atrasicarius View Post
    I voted north, but on further consideration, I'd change that to neither. Knowing what I know today, I'd just let them secede.
    And let my ancestors continue to be slaves for another generation or so?
    Real nice of ya.

    As half black I vote for the North.
    As half indian I vote for Manahasset being wrong for not wiping out the pilgrim when they had the chance,thus setting up my mother's ancestors centuries of ethnic cleansing and genocide.

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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    First of all, let's clarify who you mean when you say "the south wanted no part of the new controls."
    Clarify the actions being taken against states?

    You're referring to the governments of southern states which were not democratically elected and did not reflect the will of the people living in those states (and I mean ALL of the people living in those states). And even if they did, too bad. Human rights are not and should not be subject to a popular vote.
    This is piss poor argument. First, democratically elected officials has nothing to do with a government, but a form of government. Second, no matter the government you aren't going to get 100% approval of anything. Third, human rights as you know them weren't international issues like they are today.

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