View Poll Results: Who was right: North or South?

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  • North

    39 58.21%
  • South

    21 31.34%
  • Neither

    7 10.45%
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Thread: The Civil War

  1. #341
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Blacks suffered more after the war, than before it. In the South, free blacks had the right to vote. After the war, that right was stripped.
    I'm not normally one to cry shenanigans, but can you show me some proof for this claim? The voting claim, that is. Considering that the confederacy was founded on the right to own black people, I'm honestly surprised they could be freed at all, let alone become full citizens.
    Last edited by Paschendale; 06-15-11 at 03:07 AM.
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  2. #342
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Blacks suffered more after the war, than before it. In the South, free blacks had the right to vote. After the war, that right was stripped.
    Better to suffer as a free man than to die a slave.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  3. #343
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    I'm not normally one to cry shenanigans, but can you show me some proof for this claim? The voting claim, that is. Considering that the confederacy was founded on the right to own black people,
    Founding the Confederacy had nothing to do with, "owning black people". That's an ignorant and uninformed statement.


    I'm honestly surprised they could be freed at all, let alone become full citizens.
    First Manassas started on the farm of a freed man named James Robinson. 18% of the blacks living in Prince William County, in 1860, were free blacks, who owned land.

  4. #344
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Better to suffer as a free man than to die a slave.
    Quite a few brothers and sisters suffered as freed men, when they were slaughtered during draft riots in the North. I bet they weren't diggin' it all that much.

  5. #345
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Quite a few brothers and sisters suffered as freed men, when they were slaughtered during draft riots in the North. I bet they weren't diggin' it all that much.
    Better than being a slave. Of course you don't care because of political reasons. Makes perfect sense to me.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  6. #346
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    First Manassas started on the farm of a freed man named James Robinson. 18% of the blacks living in Prince William County, in 1860, were free blacks, who owned land.
    Wow! 18%!!!

    "According to U.S. Census data, the 1860 King William County population included 2,589 whites, 416 “free colored” and 5,525 slaves." - King William County, Virginia 1860 slaveholders and 1870 African Americans

    A whole 416 people out of 5500.

    We should celibrate!
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  7. #347
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    Re: The Civil War

    Which side would you have fought for, knowing what you know today?
    Neither. I would have been a draft dodger. The Civil War was a complete waste and simply should never have been fought. It's a gross oversimplification to say things like "the North was fighting to free slaves" or "the South was fighting for states rights." The causes of the war were too numerous and complex to be reduced to one or two major issues. None of the issues were worth the deaths of hundreds of thousands of men on both sides of the conflict, in my opinion. The South would have eventually had to change its plantation-based economic system; it simply was unsustainable. The Southern states should not have broken away from the Union, but the North should not have resorted to force to keep them from seceding.

  8. #348
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Wow! 18%!!!

    "According to U.S. Census data, the 1860 King William County population included 2,589 whites, 416 “free colored” and 5,525 slaves." - King William County, Virginia 1860 slaveholders and 1870 African Americans

    A whole 416 people out of 5500.

    We should celibrate!
    to be fair to apdst, King William County =/= Prince William County.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
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  9. #349
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    to be fair to apdst, King William County =/= Prince William County.
    Numbers are probably much the same either way.
    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    Benjii likes the protests...he'd be largely irrelevant without them. So he needs to speak where he knows there will be protests against him and that makes him responsible for the protests.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absentglare View Post
    You can successfully wipe your ass with toilet paper, that doesn't mean that you should.

  10. #350
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackdog View Post
    Wow! 18%!!!

    "According to U.S. Census data, the 1860 King William County population included 2,589 whites, 416 “free colored” and 5,525 slaves." - King William County, Virginia 1860 slaveholders and 1870 African Americans

    A whole 416 people out of 5500.

    We should celibrate!
    I bet before now, all of the, "I da South", crowd didn't even know that there were any free blacks living within the Confederacy.

    Kinda blows the, "it was all about owning black people", revisionist history out of the water. Eh?

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