View Poll Results: Who was right: North or South?

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  • North

    39 58.21%
  • South

    21 31.34%
  • Neither

    7 10.45%
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Thread: The Civil War

  1. #271
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    As always, NBF was an excellent battle commander, would of loved to see him in a Generalship position.
    I think he would of decimated the opposition.
    Check out Brice's Crossroads and you can see Forrest at his finest.

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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Your point is somewhat erroneous, because had 1) the leadership that existed in the Army of Northern Virginia still been alive in mid '64 and into '65 and 2) Lee had been in the same state of mind that he was in before Gettysburg and 3) the moral of the gerneral officers that were left was still intact, Lee would have never went head to head with Grant and therefore Grant's strategy would have been a complete failure. Had Grant taken command of the Army of The Potomac at anytime prior to the spring of '63, he would have marched his Army to death, trying to even catch a glimpse of the ANV, much less get into a headlong fight with it.
    Oh, you are talking later. Ok, no. While it would have made things much tougher in your scenario, at some point the South would have had to engage the Northern army. Letting them run free was simply not an option.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  3. #273
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Eighty Deuce View Post
    Perhaps, with Lee's first invasion of the North, had it not been for 3 lost cigars, maybe he creates enough havoc to where an accomodation prevails. As it was, instead we get the political environemt for the Emancipation Proclamation, Lincoln gets his second term, and the killing continues.
    Gotta wonder how the Maryland Campaign would have played out if Special Order 191 hadn't been discovered. Though Lee readjusted, it was certainly too late.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

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    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
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    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  4. #274
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Risky Thicket View Post
    Exactly, Forrest loved being in the field. He loved it precisely because he was able to do what he did best. He was masterful in many ways, damn near magical in some ways, however he would have hated commanding a large army and he wouldn't have been good at it. Had he commanded the Army of Northern Virginia Forrest would never have had the respect of his staff or his field officers.
    Forrest would have failed at any non-field position. Managment wasn't his forte. ACTION was.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  5. #275
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    This is actually pretty accurate. The bravery of the Confederate generals worked against them. Btw... you forgot Clerburne, another one of the South's very talented, offensively minded, "lead from the front" kind of generals. If you look at it, the North lost far fewer good strategists/tacticians. McPherson and to some degree Sedgwick are the only two that come to mind right off the top of my head.
    I've been waiting for the chance to talk about Pat Cleburne, but we hadn't even gotten to the Army of Tennessee, yet.

    Since you brought it up, the Army of Tennessee lost all it's best and brightest generals at Franklin: Cleburne, Carter, Strahl, Gist, Adams and Grandbury. With several more wounded and captured and therefore out of action.

  6. #276
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Actually, it was later in the war where he was screwed over the most, after Hood took command of the Army of Tennessee.

    It was in '62 and '63, when he had his own command, that he was able to show his natural military brilliance. Speicfically at battles like Parker's and Brice's Crossroads. Rommel studied Forrest's tactics at Parker's Crossroads, exstensively.
    He wasn't necessarily screwed over by Hood, though Hood himself was an aweful general to have in charge of the Army of Tennesse.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

  7. #277
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I've been waiting for the chance to talk about Pat Cleburne, but we hadn't even gotten to the Army of Tennessee, yet.

    Since you brought it up, the Army of Tennessee lost all it's best and brightest generals at Franklin: Cleburne, Carter, Strahl, Gist, Adams and Grandbury. With several more wounded and captured and therefore out of action.
    Do you have the whole southern OoB memorized?

    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  8. #278
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    A good example is the Gettysburg campaign. The idea was sound, but he got caught up at Gettysburg and forced to leave. If he could have maintained in the north for longer, continuing to sap Northern morale, those in the North pushing for peace may have gotten their way.
    If Suart hadn't screwed the pooch, when he was supposed to be screening the ANV's movement into Pennsylvania, Gettysburg may have had a much different outcome.

  9. #279
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Oh, you are talking later. Ok, no. While it would have made things much tougher in your scenario, at some point the South would have had to engage the Northern army. Letting them run free was simply not an option.
    Well, my point is, had the officer corps that was present in the ANV in 1863, still been present in 1864 Grant would have been out maneuvered and by the time he did engage the ANV--on ground of Lee's choosing--his soldiers would have been so sapped of their morale and energy, that he would have met with one disaster afrter another.

  10. #280
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    Re: The Civil War

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Do you have the whole southern OoB memorized?

    I, actually have two books... Generals in Blue and Generals in Gray. Bought them in 1980 at the Gettysburg Historical site. They give the biographies of every general that fought in the Civil War. I LOVE reading those books, and, like apdst, know most if not all of the general's that he mentioned. It's fascinating to read how the personalities of the men in charge had such an impact on brigades, divisions, corps, and armies. I would suggest that this was a fairly unique aspect of the American Civil War, since the Civil War was a "bridge war"... a war that bridged the gap between old and modern warfare.
    "Never fear. Him is here" - Captain Chaos (Dom DeLuise), Cannonball Run

    ====||:-D

    Quote Originally Posted by Wiseone View Post
    This is what I hate about politics the most, it turns people in snobbish egotistical self righteous dicks who allow their political beliefs, partisan attitudes, and 'us vs. them' mentality, to force them to deny reality.

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    You can't paint everone with the same brush.......It does not work tht way.


    Quote Originally Posted by Wessexman View Post
    See with you around Captain we don't even have to make arguments, as you already know everything .
    Quote Originally Posted by CriticalThought View Post
    Had you been born elsewhere or at a different time you may very well have chosen a different belief system.
    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    It a person has faith they dont need to convince another of it, and when a non believer is not interested in listening to the word of the lord, " you shake the dust from your sandels and move on"

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